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| 00:08:19 | | Watusimoto Quit (Ping timeout: 276 seconds) |
| 00:31:02 | fordcars | heh, should be fairly easy, weird |
| 00:31:42 | fordcars | are you sure you are doing a bit to bit transfer to the cd and correctly copying the distro to the cd? |
| 00:32:19 | SolumnMushroom | I'm using Power2Go image burner at the lowest speed setting |
| 00:32:56 | fordcars | heh, ok it should work |
| 00:35:21 | SolumnMushroom | Let's try MintPPC 9.3 |
| 00:36:12 | SolumnMushroom | Rather than MintPPC 11 |
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| 01:44:07 | SolumnMushroom | Let's try 11 one more time |
| 01:45:43 | SolumnMushroom | Turns out wireless works! :D |
| 01:46:00 | fordcars | heh |
| 01:46:42 | SolumnMushroom | Sort of. |
| 01:47:00 | fordcars | ... |
| 01:47:18 | SolumnMushroom | It gives me a DHCP error |
| 01:48:38 | SolumnMushroom | Back to the ethernet cable... |
| 01:48:46 | SolumnMushroom | Again |
| 02:03:49 | SolumnMushroom | Anyone interested in CRASH LOGS!?!?!? |
| 02:04:00 | SolumnMushroom | 'cause I have some |
| 02:04:48 | SolumnMushroom | From 11, not 9.3 |
| 02:16:49 | SolumnMushroom | Let's try openSUSE now... |
| 02:17:25 | | SolumnMushroom sighs in silent rage |
| 02:17:30 | bobdaduck | xD |
| 02:17:40 | bobdaduck | sorry, not a linux |
| 02:18:09 | SolumnMushroom | I understand. You, sir, are a duck, not a penguin |
| 02:21:41 | SolumnMushroom | And all of this whole 2-day Linux quest was so I could use my X-Box 360 controller with my iBook G4. *sigh* I have no life |
| 02:22:22 | SolumnMushroom | I need YouTube therapy |
| 02:24:22 | fordcars | You, sir, are a duck, not a penguin -- awesome |
| 02:24:36 | fordcars | what does ze log say? |
| 02:28:30 | fordcars | argh I hate php |
| 02:32:34 | kaen | fordcars then you've completed the first step on your way to understanding it |
| 02:32:57 | fordcars | urh, why am I getting this: The method POST is not allowed for the requested URL. in a php code? |
| 02:32:59 | kaen | SolumnMushroom if you pastebin me some logs I'll have a look |
| 02:33:13 | kaen | that's not a PHP error. what framework are you using? |
| 02:33:38 | fordcars | framework... |
| 02:33:52 | fordcars | linux... debian... |
| 02:34:01 | kaen | okay then will you put the file on pastie.org |
| 02:34:09 | kaen | I'm a good programmer but a terrible psychic |
| 02:34:17 | fordcars | ok, I will put the .php one |
| 02:34:21 | fordcars | heh |
| 02:34:26 | kaen | you have other files working with it? |
| 02:34:35 | kaen | maybe drupal stuff if I were to guess |
| 02:35:10 | SolumnMushroom | I got 3 logs. Here's one: http://pastebin.com/4M8EhY9H |
| 02:36:03 | kaen | Ideally I'd want the dmesg log |
| 02:37:58 | SolumnMushroom | http://pastebin.com/dyhtU6Vd I think this is it... |
| 02:38:12 | kaen | fordcars, that's an apache error message |
| 02:38:19 | kaen | how did you install apache? just using apt-get ? |
| 02:38:29 | kaen | yep that's it SolumnMushroom |
| 02:38:32 | kaen | looking... |
| 02:38:37 | fordcars | yeah, that's true I have that |
| 02:39:22 | kaen | can you give me some context? is it just a single php file you're using? |
| 02:39:29 | kaen | and can you paste the bugger? :) |
| 02:40:22 | fordcars | arggghhhhghghghgh I CAN't paste :( |
| 02:40:26 | fordcars | wait |
| 02:41:02 | kaen | wut? |
| 02:41:14 | kaen | okay, SolumnMushroom are you using like net install of debian? |
| 02:41:26 | SolumnMushroom | Yes |
| 02:41:43 | kaen | it looks like your machine can't connect to the internet to get the packages |
| 02:42:03 | kaen | can you confirm or disprove that? |
| 02:42:37 | fordcars | I am only right now, trying to paste on pastie.org :/ |
| 02:42:43 | fordcars | online |
| 02:42:52 | fordcars | trust me, I have internet ;) |
| 02:43:00 | kaen | that was for SolumnMushroom |
| 02:43:16 | fordcars | cnt + v doens't work in my browser, for some reasonè |
| 02:43:21 | fordcars | ooohh sorry |
| 02:43:24 | kaen | I'll start typing your names at the beginning of my messages since I'm having two conversations at once :) |
| 02:43:31 | fordcars | yep |
| 02:43:35 | SolumnMushroom | I had an ethernet connection |
| 02:43:45 | kaen | SolumnMushroom okay, sounds like I was wrong then |
| 02:43:54 | kaen | continuing to browse the logs... |
| 02:44:50 | kaen | Apr 3 01:51:13 main-menu[230]: (process:3898): wget: bad address 'mintppc.org' |
| 02:44:51 | kaen | Apr 3 01:51:13 main-menu[230]: WARNING **: Configuring 'network-preseed' failed with error code 1 |
| 02:44:58 | kaen | ^ this is why I thought that. |
| 02:46:07 | kaen | SolumnMushroom is this mintppc 9.3? |
| 02:47:06 | kaen | and then there's Apr 3 01:58:32 kernel: [ 800.583281] Buffer I/O error on device sdb, logical block 160836480 |
| 02:47:18 | kaen | which indicates that whatever disk is mounted on sdb is failing |
| 02:48:20 | kaen | sdb is likely your external cd/dvd drive, so either the disk is not properly burnt or your cd/dvd drive is going out |
| 02:48:57 | kaen | and if all of your disks aren't burning right, it's probably the latter. |
| 02:50:25 | SolumnMushroom | It should be MintPPC 11 |
| 02:55:17 | | bobdaduck Quit (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 02:57:35 | fordcars | hehe, finally managed to paste the code: http://pastie.org/7293381 |
| 02:57:42 | fordcars | a simple .php file |
| 03:03:17 | kaen | huh. and it's actually named .php ? |
| 03:03:48 | fordcars | yep |
| 03:03:55 | fordcars | well chat.php |
| 03:04:22 | kaen | okay can you post the last twenty or so line of your apache log? |
| 03:04:31 | kaen | /var/log/httpd/error_log |
| 03:04:36 | kaen | or /var/log/apache/error_log |
| 03:05:16 | kaen | SolumnMushroom, dude I'm stumped |
| 03:06:13 | SolumnMushroom | Me too. I guess openSUSE is the future |
| 03:06:35 | kaen | did installing opensuse work? |
| 03:07:05 | kaen | because honestly opensuse is better than debian or fedora imo |
| 03:07:34 | kaen | but looking at mintppc.org it seems like just some dude with a cross compiler |
| 03:07:46 | kaen | so I don't think it's a very good port. |
| 03:08:23 | fordcars | euh, I don't have either of these logs |
| 03:09:04 | fordcars | does it help to mension I'm on a RaspberryPi? |
| 03:09:13 | fordcars | mention* |
| 03:09:13 | kaen | hmm potentially |
| 03:09:22 | fordcars | debian wheezy |
| 03:09:29 | kaen | do you have ~/www folder? |
| 03:09:32 | fordcars | rasbian |
| 03:09:34 | kaen | or a /var/www ? |
| 03:09:36 | SolumnMushroom | I haven't tried yet. I'm going to sleep now. Goodnight! |
| 03:09:39 | kaen | night! |
| 03:09:46 | | SolumnMushroom Quit (Quit: Leaving) |
| 03:10:14 | fordcars | no... |
| 03:10:21 | kaen | neither? |
| 03:10:30 | fordcars | no... |
| 03:10:31 | kaen | that's nuts. where's the php file at? |
| 03:11:13 | fordcars | is it hidden? |
| 03:11:23 | kaen | it shouldn't be |
| 03:11:25 | fordcars | the log |
| 03:12:16 | kaen | oh, yes it is |
| 03:12:20 | kaen | /private/var/log/apache2 |
| 03:12:22 | kaen | try there ^ |
| 03:17:39 | kaen | also, look for a folder called cgi-bin and try putting the php file in there and pointing your form to its new location |
| 03:17:53 | kaen | fordcars, ^ |
| 03:18:39 | fordcars | why do I have to do this anyway6 |
| 03:18:42 | fordcars | *? |
| 03:19:13 | kaen | apache will not accept POST requests to the current location of the php file |
| 03:19:22 | kaen | it is usually configured to allow them within cgi-bin |
| 03:20:12 | | Platskies Quit (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 03:20:28 | fordcars | argh, where is cgi-bin supposed to be |
| 03:21:38 | kaen | maybe in /Users/USERNAME/Sites |
| 03:21:41 | kaen | but I'm not positive |
| 03:22:20 | kaen | should be in the document root of your apache site (wherever localhost/ points to) |
| 03:28:15 | fordcars | euh, should I install php5? Or any type of php :/ |
| 03:28:31 | fordcars | I might of had skipped tht pasrt |
| 03:28:43 | kaen | roflmao |
| 03:28:52 | kaen | yes, you'll need to install php5 |
| 03:28:55 | fordcars | oops :3 |
| 03:28:59 | kaen | and also mod_php |
| 03:29:01 | kaen | for apache |
| 03:29:53 | fordcars | yay, so I will use the module apache then? |
| 03:30:03 | fordcars | Using PHP as an Apache module |
| 03:30:06 | kaen | yes |
| 03:30:09 | fordcars | mod_php |
| 03:30:12 | fordcars | goooooooood |
| 03:30:13 | kaen | a2enmod mod_php |
| 03:30:15 | kaen | yes |
| 03:30:57 | kaen | actually just `a2enmod php` after you've install apache, php5, and mod_php |
| 03:31:05 | kaen | you'll also need to restart apache |
| 03:31:42 | fordcars | wait wait wait, I have apache, so I need a2enmod php, php5 and mod_php? |
| 03:32:05 | kaen | you have to install apache, php5, and mod_php |
| 03:32:11 | kaen | and then run `a2enmod php` |
| 03:32:14 | kaen | and then restart apache |
| 03:32:19 | fordcars | ok |
| 03:32:42 | fordcars | ouch, did I install apache? |
| 03:32:46 | fordcars | before |
| 03:32:59 | kaen | looks like it |
| 03:33:10 | fordcars | wait... |
| 03:35:13 | | raptor has joined |
| 03:35:13 | | ChanServ sets mode +o raptor |
| 03:35:44 | kaen | hello raptor |
| 03:35:52 | raptor | a pounce! |
| 03:35:54 | raptor | hi |
| 03:36:03 | kaen | eheh |
| 03:36:11 | fordcars | hi |
| 03:36:42 | kaen | fordcars, trollbot? |
| 03:37:08 | fordcars | yep :P |
| 03:37:10 | kaen | too many novelty maps, we needed more novelty bots :P |
| 03:37:27 | fordcars | I always get this====== Unable to fech some archives...404,,, |
| 03:37:34 | fordcars | yep :P |
| 03:37:42 | kaen | what are you installing with? |
| 03:37:56 | fordcars | apt-get |
| 03:37:57 | kaen | sounds like you need to update its package lists |
| 03:37:59 | kaen | oh |
| 03:38:05 | kaen | run `apt-get update` |
| 03:38:11 | kaen | and try again |
| 03:38:44 | fordcars | when I do tyhat, it says: methode driver ....... http: not found |
| 03:39:00 | raptor | so i gather two things from the logs: php rage and ppc linux rage |
| 03:39:04 | raptor | does that sum it up? |
| 03:39:08 | kaen | precisely |
| 03:39:26 | kaen | except that I'm not only a programmer but a zen master. |
| 03:39:36 | kaen | so rather it is "oneness with php and ppc linux" |
| 03:39:45 | kaen | I *am* rage |
| 03:39:52 | fordcars | haha |
| 03:40:14 | fordcars | so any ideas? |
| 03:40:27 | kaen | actually I'm pretty stumped. pastie the log and I'll have a peek |
| 03:40:41 | kaen | you've got problems within problems fordcars |
| 03:41:02 | kaen | nothing's worse than a recursive problem |
| 03:41:05 | fordcars | arghhhhghghghghghghhghghghghhghgghhghhghhgghghhghhghghhghhghhghhghhghhghhghhgh |
| 03:41:33 | raptor | another bot! |
| 03:41:34 | kaen | ah, php |
| 03:41:45 | raptor | man, people must be figuring out our API or something.. |
| 03:42:12 | fordcars | huh? |
| 03:42:21 | fordcars | a lua bot or a spam bot |
| 03:43:11 | kaen | if it's a spam bot then we're probably gaining page rank, and maybe becoming a worthwhile target. |
| 03:43:44 | kaen | oh derp he means a lua bot |
| 03:43:51 | kaen | referring, most likely, to yours fordcars |
| 03:44:11 | fordcars | mhahahah ah ok |
| 03:44:12 | raptor | sorry, i mean two people released Lua bots today |
| 03:44:16 | raptor | that's like a record! |
| 03:44:24 | fordcars | I am actually working on an awesome bot |
| 03:45:01 | kaen | the bot writing tourny is slowly coming together... |
| 03:46:25 | fordcars | hehe |
| 03:46:31 | fordcars | I like bots |
| 03:46:49 | fordcars | but bots kick butts |
| 03:50:10 | raptor | i fixed sentinel 2 more times again |
| 03:52:01 | fordcars | Actually, I might not need php apache2 bla bla bla...... I use flask for my server |
| 03:52:15 | kaen | dude what? |
| 03:52:15 | fordcars | python module |
| 03:52:21 | kaen | I know what it is |
| 03:52:23 | kaen | but I mean... |
| 03:52:35 | kaen | why would you even mess around with php then? |
| 03:52:44 | fordcars | I know, right? |
| 03:53:20 | fordcars | since apt-get installed falled, did it still install some apache junk |
| 03:53:41 | kaen | if it failed while fetching it should abort all operations |
| 03:53:56 | fordcars | gooooooooood I like linux afterall |
| 03:54:10 | fordcars | so I should just code my stuff in python with flask, then |
| 03:54:25 | kaen | if a rasberry pi will support it, go ahead |
| 03:55:07 | fordcars | you bet, I am using it like that I can control the RaspberryPi's GPIO pins, really neat stuff |
| 03:55:27 | fordcars | heh, well thanks allot kaen, seriously, you rock |
| 03:55:41 | kaen | no sweat. glad to help an eager student :) |
| 03:55:58 | fordcars | :D |
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| 04:17:55 | fordcars | brb |
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| 04:38:30 | raptor | hi bobdaduck, I went through the solid gold level server and added a few possibles to the list for BBBX |
| 04:38:39 | raptor | feel free to scrap all of them |
| 04:39:31 | fordcars | phew, I am back |
| 04:41:10 | raptor | team sorting UNACCEPTABLE |
| 04:44:11 | bobdaduck | okay |
| 04:49:48 | raptor | kaen: still up? |
| 04:49:54 | kaen | always! |
| 04:50:03 | kaen | I sleep in microseconds. |
| 04:50:08 | raptor | do we want to change the player ratings to between 0 and 1? |
| 04:50:19 | kaen | definitely |
| 04:50:28 | raptor | because I'm not so sure our sort is working - it says it sorts from highest to lowest |
| 04:50:42 | raptor | but i don't believe it - and it looks like the sort is twice as big as it needs to be |
| 04:50:52 | bobdaduck | uh |
| 04:51:06 | bobdaduck | I hypothesized a rework for you guys |
| 04:51:16 | raptor | do tell! |
| 04:51:16 | bobdaduck | (never got around to actually doing the work but.) |
| 04:51:16 | raptor | (I forgot) |
| 04:51:30 | raptor | also, I wasn't planning on that big of a rework yet - just to fix the dumb sorting |
| 04:52:08 | raptor | because I was the lowest scored player with me zafrrina and Little_Apple in like 20 games tonight and I was *always* put on the team by myself |
| 04:53:15 | kaen | yep, that's super broken |
| 04:53:18 | kaen | no doubt about it |
| 04:54:05 | kaen | erm, where's this code at? |
| 04:54:37 | raptor | took me 5 min to find it... ServerGame.cpp:680 |
| 04:55:04 | raptor | ha! the algo is soooo broke |
| 04:55:55 | raptor | it would work if both numbers are positive... |
| 04:56:16 | kaen | bobdaduck |
| 04:56:30 | kaen | ^did you read that ? |
| 04:56:30 | raptor | this is just a temp fix bobdaduck to ease my suffering |
| 04:56:44 | kaen | it's just funny because he totally called it. |
| 04:56:57 | raptor | really? |
| 04:57:04 | kaen | he mentioned this like three weeks ago |
| 04:57:06 | kaen | maybe more |
| 04:57:13 | raptor | I vaguely remember |
| 04:57:14 | kaen | that negative numbers broke the algo |
| 04:58:29 | raptor | ok, so i can fix the algo OR fix the algo and normalize the numbers |
| 04:59:03 | raptor | how lazy should I be and will a normalization between 0 and 1 be less confusing? |
| 04:59:08 | kaen | well just fixing the algo is the least dramatic change |
| 04:59:19 | raptor | because right now, negative means you die more than kill.. |
| 04:59:46 | kaen | I'd keep negative numbers for now |
| 04:59:55 | raptor | yeah ok |
| 05:04:35 | raptor | yessss it works |
| 05:08:56 | | BFLogBot Commit: b7b1ca23f096 | Author: buckyballreaction | Message: Fix team sorting not working with negative player ratings |
| 05:08:58 | | BFLogBot Commit: 1348708633e9 | Author: buckyballreaction | Message: Fix compiler warning |
| 05:12:48 | bobdaduck | Okay I'm back |
| 05:12:51 | bobdaduck | So... Wait what? |
| 05:13:00 | raptor | sorting works properly now |
| 05:13:07 | bobdaduck | like how? |
| 05:13:18 | raptor | but I have not done any algorithmic changes to how the rating is calculated |
| 05:13:27 | raptor | just fixed the sorting to the current system |
| 05:14:27 | raptor | basically, negative numbers were being sorted as higher than positive numbers in some cases |
| 05:16:35 | bobdaduck | So everything is still broken |
| 05:16:44 | raptor | yes, but its fixed! |
| 05:17:00 | raptor | I'm thinking I should make a short list of patches needed for the BBB... |
| 05:17:04 | raptor | this being one of them |
| 05:26:25 | raptor | bobdaduck: what are the patches I gave you again for your version of 018a? |
| 05:31:06 | raptor | we need a better asteroid spawn marker.. |
| 05:34:07 | bobdaduck | Uh |
| 05:34:14 | bobdaduck | I think levelgen forcefields |
| 05:34:25 | raptor | we don't need that for the BBB do we? |
| 05:35:41 | bobdaduck | no |
| 05:36:37 | raptor | any other fix you can think of? |
| 05:50:56 | fordcars | yes, I am done working! I can fnally sleep... |
| 05:51:08 | fordcars | night guys |
| 05:52:04 | raptor | good night! |
| 05:52:12 | raptor | me too - time for bed |
| 05:52:13 | raptor | night! |
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| 14:45:54 | bobdaduck | I think bitfighter ships need character stats and traits that we can shuffle out. |
| 14:46:05 | kaen | morning |
| 14:46:07 | bobdaduck | Str/Dex/Const/Wis/Luk |
| 14:46:14 | kaen | lol wis |
| 14:46:20 | kaen | for casting, of course |
| 14:46:24 | bobdaduck | Yeah |
| 14:46:46 | bobdaduck | We'll just start calling the energy bar a mana bar |
| 14:46:51 | kaen | world of bitfighter |
| 14:46:56 | kaen | we already have dungeons |
| 14:47:02 | bobdaduck | Exactly! |
| 14:47:19 | kaen | and trolls! |
| 14:47:26 | kaen | I think this is a good direction. |
| 14:47:34 | bobdaduck | That was a request of mine, actually. Allow levelgen modifying of basic ship elements, such as max speed/health/damage |
| 14:47:39 | bobdaduck | Exactly! |
| 14:47:44 | bobdaduck | Also ship traits. |
| 14:47:47 | bobdaduck | !bobdaduck |
| 14:47:49 | BFLogBot | Level 3 programmer/priest/beta tester/mad scientist |
| 14:48:17 | bobdaduck | Just change some terminology |
| 14:48:34 | bobdaduck | Since my bitfighter is a priest |
| 14:48:39 | bobdaduck | instead of repair it casts "heal" |
| 14:48:49 | kaen | to bring this back into the realm of serious discussion, I think modifying the attributes of ships is intentionally not possible for levelgens |
| 14:49:23 | kaen | but line between what a levelgen should and should not have access to is becoming ever more blurry |
| 14:49:57 | bobdaduck | To quote raptor: "I think what we're doing is locking down all possible exploits in the game, and then making them possible with levelgens" |
| 14:50:05 | kaen | bahaha |
| 14:50:12 | kaen | that's accurate. |
| 14:50:47 | kaen | as it stands, you can easily auto-kill a player |
| 14:50:58 | kaen | (drop like 4 mines directly on top of them -- done) |
| 14:51:13 | bobdaduck | Right but I want to be able to level up someone's bitfighter ship |
| 14:51:15 | kaen | and you can (effectively) remove them from the game. |
| 14:51:24 | kaen | well, you definitely can't do that |
| 14:51:29 | bobdaduck | exactly |
| 14:51:35 | kaen | but is that really something that would be good to expose? |
| 14:51:38 | bobdaduck | Why can I level-drain someone but not level-up someone? |
| 14:51:49 | kaen | damn it man, it's too early for bitfighter philosophy |
| 14:51:54 | bobdaduck | xDD |
| 14:52:15 | bobdaduck | You started it! |
| 14:52:27 | kaen | you're right ._. |
| 14:52:28 | bobdaduck | I just wanted to play an orcish-rogue bitfighter ship. |
| 14:52:51 | bobdaduck | Why wouldn't it be a good thing to expose? |
| 14:53:22 | kaen | hard to articulate, but levelgens currently are at least confined to the mechanics of the game |
| 14:53:46 | kaen | whereas exposing ship attribute modification would directly violate that axiom |
| 14:54:00 | bobdaduck | I can do that by resource-hacking the game anyway |
| 14:54:08 | kaen | only on your client |
| 14:54:13 | kaen | and then you'll go out of sync |
| 14:54:16 | bobdaduck | Not if I'm hosting |
| 14:54:26 | kaen | then you've got a modded server |
| 14:54:44 | bobdaduck | So... Our game is already exposed to modding. |
| 14:54:47 | kaen | since it's an open source game, we are powerless to stop that |
| 14:55:00 | kaen | yes, but a modded server is very likely to be incompatible with clients |
| 14:55:17 | kaen | even if it is compatible, the corrections from the server might render the game unplayable |
| 14:55:37 | kaen | so to effectively distribute a proper mod you'd have to distribute a modded client too |
| 14:55:57 | bobdaduck | From experience, resource hacking a server doesn't cause any weird issues for anyone. |
| 14:56:01 | kaen | and there's a difference between that and adding an in-game mechanism for that sort of manipulation |
| 14:56:43 | bobdaduck | But... We already did with levelgens |
| 14:56:55 | kaen | not for the specific modifications you were suggesting |
| 14:57:07 | kaen | and as I mentioned, levelgens can't affect game mechanics. |
| 14:57:16 | bobdaduck | They kind of can. |
| 14:57:30 | bobdaduck | A gravity well |
| 14:57:31 | kaen | I mean like damage calculation |
| 14:57:38 | bobdaduck | Making a testitem not move |
| 14:57:57 | kaen | okay, so physics are manipulable |
| 14:58:00 | bobdaduck | Damage calculation is a level deeper true, but not a step further in philosophy |
| 14:58:29 | kaen | levelgens are such a can of worms... |
| 14:58:39 | bobdaduck | xD |
| 14:58:54 | bobdaduck | Yes I'm not sure why they're there in the first place. |
| 14:59:03 | kaen | it was trendy |
| 14:59:15 | kaen | jk, I'm sure there's a better reason |
| 14:59:18 | bobdaduck | I assume it was just engineer again. Now its there and won't get removed |
| 14:59:19 | kaen | but I sincerely do not know it |
| 14:59:31 | bobdaduck | Trusting levelmakers to use it responsibly |
| 14:59:49 | kaen | yeah, seems like a bad call |
| 15:00:11 | kaen | it assumes some sort of critical evaluation of the levels they produce |
| 15:00:15 | kaen | which doesn't really happen |
| 15:00:36 | kaen | but if we could establish some criteria, some common-sense standard of a "good" use of levelgens |
| 15:00:50 | kaen | and commend honors based on a level's attainment of that ideal |
| 15:00:56 | bobdaduck | Community is so small that you can tell exactly how each person is going to react to given power |
| 15:01:01 | kaen | and give no credence to people who abuse it |
| 15:01:13 | kaen | then I think it would approve |
| 15:01:18 | bobdaduck | And, uh, I abuse it. And everyone loves it. |
| 15:01:30 | bobdaduck | I'm not sure giving no credence is viable. |
| 15:01:47 | kaen | it's all about the culture we establish |
| 15:01:51 | kaen | and culture starts at the top |
| 15:02:23 | bobdaduck | I've been trying to establish a culture of wanting to put hats on ships |
| 15:02:28 | kaen | but yes, people like "pop-levelgens" more than serious technical innovation. |
| 15:02:34 | bobdaduck | Tophat and monacle'd triangle |
| 15:03:21 | kaen | I made a levelgen to add passwords to dungeons. I'll never release it though I think. |
| 15:03:37 | kaen | 1. it would never be appreciated 2. I hate dungeons and do not want to improve them in any way |
| 15:03:53 | kaen | I mean like old-school start-from-where-you-left-off passwords |
| 15:04:10 | bobdaduck | Simple enough to do |
| 15:04:23 | bobdaduck | and 2: yes. |
| 15:04:23 | bobdaduck | xD |
| 15:04:25 | kaen | I'd like to see your implementation. |
| 15:04:38 | kaen | because in my experience it was actually very simple. |
| 15:04:42 | kaen | was not* |
| 15:05:22 | bobdaduck | subscribe to onMsgRecieved |
| 15:05:36 | kaen | yes that's the easy part |
| 15:05:43 | bobdaduck | forcefield1:setHealth(0) |
| 15:05:55 | bobdaduck | All dungeons use a checkpoint system |
| 15:06:12 | kaen | my script is reusable |
| 15:06:21 | bobdaduck | ooh shiny |
| 15:06:23 | kaen | and allows for other level state modifications beyond forcefields |
| 15:06:36 | bobdaduck | like...? |
| 15:06:48 | kaen | by using callbacks to incrementally go from one "level" of the dungeon to the next |
| 15:07:00 | kaen | like removing a testitem or wtfever else you dungeon makers do |
| 15:07:05 | kaen | or killing turrets |
| 15:07:26 | kaen | and then it also has password generation based on a seed |
| 15:08:16 | kaen | but anyway doesn't matter |
| 15:08:23 | bobdaduck | Impressive |
| 15:08:32 | bobdaduck | Excessive |
| 15:08:41 | kaen | effective and feature complete |
| 15:08:47 | kaen | I think are the words you're looking for |
| 15:09:13 | kaen | hmm. size limit for screenshots |
| 15:09:16 | kaen | 640x480? |
| 15:09:20 | kaen | or 800x600? |
| 15:09:54 | bobdaduck | 800x600 I think |
| 15:10:20 | kaen | I agree. How about thumbnails? |
| 15:10:56 | bobdaduck | Why bother? |
| 15:11:29 | kaen | lets people differentiate their level more when listing them |
| 15:12:14 | kaen | if all you see is the name and author and rating, you still have no idea about the content of the level itself |
| 15:12:31 | kaen | and obviously displaying the whole screenshot in a list of levels is unacceptable. |
| 15:12:46 | bobdaduck | Right. |
| 15:12:59 | bobdaduck | But I don't think you can accurately represent a level via thumbnail...? |
| 15:13:19 | kaen | yeah, pretty much just the shape |
| 15:13:22 | kaen | all you'd see is walls |
| 15:14:16 | bobdaduck | I dunno |
| 15:14:25 | bobdaduck | When/if I get home today |
| 15:14:39 | kaen | I just resized a screenshot, lemme upload it for you |
| 15:14:40 | bobdaduck | Remind me and I'll work with you on thumbnails and improving the database |
| 15:14:45 | bobdaduck | okay |
| 15:15:35 | bobdaduck | bebop is better than just a novelty! |
| 15:16:06 | kaen | http://imagebin.org/252654 |
| 15:16:26 | kaen | that's 200x150 (same aspect ratio) and comes out to 9kb |
| 15:16:53 | bobdaduck | that's tiny |
| 15:17:03 | bobdaduck | and... Not really all that helpful |
| 15:17:34 | kaen | yes, but in a list of levels it would at least give you some visual cue to go off of |
| 15:17:41 | bobdaduck | True |
| 15:17:45 | kaen | I mean the alternative is just never have images on level lists |
| 15:17:58 | bobdaduck | yeah |
| 15:17:59 | kaen | which I imagine is even less helpful |
| 15:18:09 | bobdaduck | Only by a little bit. |
| 15:18:28 | kaen | well, I'll get it working with 200x150 and then let you do an A/B test |
| 15:18:46 | kaen | I'm reasonably sure thumbnails are a good thing so I don't mind mocking it up |
| 15:19:15 | bobdaduck | okay |
| 15:20:25 | bobdaduck | We used to have a ctrl-A feature |
| 15:20:32 | bobdaduck | that hid everything but walls in the level editor. |
| 15:20:49 | bobdaduck | Dunno what happened to it (now ctrl-A selects all) |
| 15:21:16 | bobdaduck | But I was thinking that if you could get the database to show just the wall structure of a level in a thumbnail/auto generated screenshot... |
| 15:21:22 | bobdaduck | *shrug* just a thought. |
| 15:23:21 | bobdaduck | I still want my bitfighter ship to be an orcish rogue. |
| 15:23:51 | kaen | actually I was thinking along those lines (although I didn't know it used to be a feature!) |
| 15:24:20 | kaen | I had the idea of a screenshot mode in the editor which would display walls, flags, spawn points, etc |
| 15:24:59 | kaen | that way the screenshots on the DB could give information about design of the level |
| 15:25:04 | bobdaduck | Yeah |
| 15:25:15 | kaen | and not all the HUD cruft or grid lines |
| 15:25:31 | bobdaduck | Yeah |
| 15:25:50 | bobdaduck | The kaen test uploader you gave me no longer works last I checked, by the way. |
| 15:26:03 | kaen | oh yeah... |
| 15:26:08 | kaen | I lost my domain names because I'm broke |
| 15:26:23 | kaen | you can try using the IP, lemme get it |
| 15:27:00 | kaen | http://198.23.227.119/uploader.php |
| 15:27:26 | kaen | it's the same IP as on the server list screen. |
| 15:28:16 | bobdaduck | Alright, RTS and Feudalism fixes uploaded |
| 15:28:32 | kaen | \o/ |
| 16:32:45 | | koda Quit (Ping timeout: 264 seconds) |
| 16:59:41 | | watusimoto Quit (Ping timeout: 255 seconds) |
| 17:01:11 | bobdaduck | Welp |
| 17:01:17 | bobdaduck | Just the three of us. |
| 17:01:32 | kaen | I just put the thumbnail code on pleiades |
| 17:01:37 | kaen | uploading screenshots... |
| 17:01:48 | bobdaduck | broken gifs everywhere! |
| 17:02:25 | bobdaduck | Oh there we go |
| 17:02:59 | bobdaduck | That's fun |
| 17:03:03 | bobdaduck | I like the new home page |
| 17:03:17 | bobdaduck | What's the maximum displayed cutoff? |
| 17:03:37 | kaen | 3 for each |
| 17:03:44 | kaen | make sure to hit ctrl+F5 a few times |
| 17:03:55 | kaen | the level entries should be a different color than the background |
| 17:04:13 | bobdaduck | ctrl F5? |
| 17:04:22 | kaen | deep refresh |
| 17:04:27 | bobdaduck | okey |
| 17:04:28 | bobdaduck | well |
| 17:04:45 | kaen | I changed the stylesheet and it will look like garbage if your browser doesn't retrieve it |
| 17:04:53 | bobdaduck | lol |
| 17:05:00 | bobdaduck | F5 is usually enough |
| 17:05:07 | bobdaduck | anway looks fin |
| 17:05:20 | bobdaduck | broeken gifs were before you uploaded screenshots |
| 17:06:07 | kaen | yeah I didn't do a "no screenshot" image yet |
| 17:06:15 | bobdaduck | I guess it works |
| 17:06:42 | kaen | I can look at the first two and recognize them |
| 17:06:44 | bobdaduck | I'd like the maximum to be 5 |
| 17:06:49 | kaen | but geo-wars looks crazy |
| 17:06:55 | kaen | max 5 sounds reasonable |
| 17:07:05 | kaen | it might be 4 just to keep them all on one line |
| 17:07:06 | bobdaduck | perhaps even 10 |
| 17:07:11 | kaen | or two lines |
| 17:07:23 | kaen | I think 10 is better |
| 17:07:29 | kaen | or whatever two rows turns out to be |
| 17:07:37 | bobdaduck | yeah |
| 17:08:58 | kaen | derp. |
| 17:09:04 | kaen | ratings bump "recently updated" |
| 17:09:10 | bobdaduck | lol |
| 17:09:11 | kaen | I wrote a test to specifically prevent that.... |
| 17:09:17 | kaen | clearly the test is broken. |
| 17:09:31 | bobdaduck | google chrome says the page is in dutch and wants to know if it should translate it |
| 17:09:44 | kaen | I meant for it to only bump when content/levelgen is updated |
| 17:09:49 | kaen | yeah I'm getting that too.... |
| 17:09:52 | kaen | I have no idea why |
| 17:09:58 | kaen | did it do that before? |
| 17:10:06 | bobdaduck | lol dunno |
| 17:10:12 | bobdaduck | I think its because the level code though |
| 17:10:28 | bobdaduck | unless there's some sort of HTML metadata you're missing |
| 17:10:46 | kaen | that's very possible |
| 17:10:51 | kaen | it could also be the server configuration |
| 17:11:00 | kaen | because it definitely does *not* happen on my machine. |
| 17:11:10 | bobdaduck | yeah |
| 17:11:53 | kaen | I think I'll keep the thumbnails |
| 17:12:01 | bobdaduck | Yeah |
| 17:12:04 | bobdaduck | It looks more solid |
| 17:12:06 | kaen | it's pretty essential to this display format |
| 17:12:08 | bobdaduck | even if they're ugly |
| 17:12:11 | kaen | less boring |
| 17:12:13 | kaen | yes |
| 17:12:23 | kaen | I can tweak the filtering maybe to help that |
| 17:13:13 | bobdaduck | Do you have plans for a layout/graphics/style/whatever rather than grey with "pleiades"? |
| 17:22:42 | kaen | all the style stuff is up in the air |
| 17:23:04 | kaen | everything you see are quick jobs just so I didn't have to look at black on white Times New Roman |
| 17:23:34 | kaen | I was thinking about using bitfighter's palette |
| 17:23:44 | kaen | although the main colors it uses are atrocious |
| 17:24:53 | bobdaduck | lol |
| 17:24:59 | bobdaduck | yeahhh |
| 17:25:37 | kaen | I just looked |
| 17:25:46 | kaen | it's saturated red, green and blue |
| 17:26:15 | bobdaduck | According to google, pink goes well with grey. |
| 17:26:21 | bobdaduck | And light blue/purple/red. |
| 17:26:37 | bobdaduck | So just make the boxes pink and we'll be set |
| 17:26:44 | kaen | I took the current palette from a telescope image of Pleiades |
| 17:27:10 | kaen | I was actually going to use it as a subtle background but the image is just too huge |
| 17:27:19 | kaen | and a small version doesn't tile |
| 17:27:58 | bobdaduck | yeah |
| 17:28:19 | | raptor has joined |
| 17:28:19 | | ChanServ sets mode +o raptor |
| 17:28:27 | kaen | morning raptor |
| 17:28:52 | raptor | good morning! |
| 17:29:41 | bobdaduck | Good morning raptor! |
| 17:29:50 | raptor | hello |
| 17:30:06 | bobdaduck | So bitfighter needs to have character stats and classes |
| 17:30:14 | bobdaduck | str/dex/wis/const/luk |
| 17:30:19 | | raptor is appalled at what he's reading in the logs |
| 17:30:22 | bobdaduck | And I'll be an orcish rogue bitfighter ship |
| 17:30:23 | bobdaduck | xDD |
| 17:30:42 | bobdaduck | Oh right, the logs |
| 17:32:00 | bobdaduck | So we'll shuffle the names on loadouts |
| 17:32:30 | bobdaduck | Haste - Barrier - Heal - clairvoyance - stealth - fortify |
| 17:32:56 | bobdaduck | ...And that's how I know that bitfighter ships are priests. They have priest spells! |
| 17:33:19 | bobdaduck | Obviously a wizard would have things like magic missile (er, seeker.) |
| 17:34:04 | bobdaduck | And we'll have levels, but they won't actually do anything |
| 17:34:11 | bobdaduck | Just to make people think they're progressing or whatever |
| 17:34:25 | bobdaduck | Phaser druids will be the most overpowered class |
| 17:34:59 | raptor | bitfighter is not supposed to be warcraft III... I think |
| 17:35:29 | bobdaduck | world of bitfighter |
| 17:36:00 | bobdaduck | No you're the devs. You can CHOOSE if bitfighter is supposed to be warcraft III! |
| 17:37:03 | bobdaduck | RTS was originally going to be warcraft III... |
| 17:45:09 | raptor | ok |
| 17:45:34 | bobdaduck | Ok? |
| 17:45:39 | raptor | now I'm questioning my purpose in life with respect to bitfighter - the urge to do neat stuff seems to conflict with the requirement for a solid game |
| 17:46:21 | bobdaduck | 019 will be the first actual "solid game" patch we've ever had. |
| 17:46:40 | raptor | what makes you say that? the balance changes? |
| 17:46:44 | bobdaduck | Yeah. |
| 17:46:59 | bobdaduck | I mean, network and code maintainance has happened a lot |
| 17:47:07 | bobdaduck | but actual gameplay hasn't really been touched. At all. |
| 17:47:30 | bobdaduck | Mines were changed to take 50% energy from 90% energy in release 007 ish. |
| 17:47:40 | raptor | oh wow |
| 17:47:43 | raptor | 90%!? |
| 17:47:49 | bobdaduck | That's literally the only thing I can think of at all. |
| 17:48:00 | raptor | with that amount, they should be non-triggerable by teammates |
| 17:48:41 | raptor | so from the logs I basically get: not much actually... thumbnail support in pleasides |
| 17:48:55 | kaen | yep |
| 17:48:57 | raptor | WOW |
| 17:48:59 | raptor | it's true! |
| 17:49:00 | bobdaduck | xD |
| 17:49:22 | kaen | trying to make it not suck right now... |
| 17:49:31 | raptor | bebop has this giane circle in it |
| 17:49:41 | kaen | I did that to test the aliasing |
| 17:49:46 | raptor | oh man - screenshots without GL_BLEND are horrid |
| 17:49:50 | kaen | yeah |
| 17:50:09 | raptor | down votes? |
| 17:50:22 | kaen | for now. they're easy to remove |
| 17:50:26 | raptor | i have a hard time trusting mob rule |
| 17:50:36 | raptor | with up or down |
| 17:50:47 | raptor | but i can't think of anything better |
| 17:50:57 | bobdaduck | Yeah |
| 17:51:03 | raptor | maybe show both + and minus |
| 17:51:12 | raptor | plus and - |
| 17:51:13 | kaen | thatd be better |
| 17:51:19 | bobdaduck | much better xD |
| 17:51:47 | kaen | I think I'll do it SO style: one total in most places |
| 17:51:54 | kaen | click the total to see up/down totals |
| 17:52:13 | bobdaduck | Raptor |
| 17:52:14 | raptor | that way mob rule can be mitigated via correct information |
| 17:52:18 | raptor | yes |
| 17:52:27 | bobdaduck | Tonight you fix forcefield snapping. |
| 17:52:44 | kaen | dude forcefield snapping is such a ridiculous bug |
| 17:52:50 | raptor | that will require editor codework |
| 17:52:57 | raptor | a badge-worthy feat |
| 17:53:01 | kaen | indeed |
| 17:53:04 | raptor | brb |
| 17:53:57 | bobdaduck | Its a ridiculous bug but |
| 17:54:02 | bobdaduck | This secret level I'm working on |
| 17:54:08 | bobdaduck | is as big as RTS |
| 17:54:12 | bobdaduck | And every time I reload it |
| 17:54:23 | bobdaduck | I have to readjust half the forcefields |
| 17:56:53 | bobdaduck | I realize its probably a hard bug to fix but its gotten to the point where I don't even want to work on the map anymore |
| 17:57:52 | kaen | in fact it's possibly the ugliest part of the editor code |
| 17:58:06 | kaen | it combines editor stuff, game object stuff, and geometry |
| 17:58:32 | kaen | and also manipulates the state of the level as it builds it... |
| 17:58:38 | kaen | okay I can't look anymore |
| 17:58:43 | bobdaduck | xD |
| 17:59:11 | bobdaduck | I feel like fixing this bug should take priority over adding functionality. |
| 17:59:58 | raptor | so the editor rewrite was basically why 016 took ~10 months to release |
| 18:00:20 | raptor | before the editor used it's own variation of *every* game object |
| 18:00:47 | bobdaduck | yeah |
| 18:01:40 | bobdaduck | I see no glaring bugs in the editor other than this and then nobody will have to touch it ever agian? |
| 18:02:16 | raptor | you have no idea the pain I went through to fix the last two editor bugs |
| 18:02:28 | raptor | (not saying I won't attempt it...) |
| 18:02:47 | bobdaduck | PRIORITY ABOVE SUNS. |
| 18:02:51 | raptor | haha |
| 18:03:52 | bobdaduck | Do you remember my simple case? |
| 18:04:25 | kaen | >>> before the editor used it's own variation of *every* game object |
| 18:04:27 | raptor | no. can you tell me again? (I'm writing it down now) |
| 18:04:31 | kaen | oh my good god. |
| 18:04:50 | raptor | kaen: yeah, basically any time we wanted to make a change to an object, we had to make it twice |
| 18:04:58 | | kaen shudders |
| 18:05:36 | bobdaduck | Okay so I just thought of two different ways |
| 18:05:51 | bobdaduck | can I just pastie a level for you? |
| 18:05:53 | raptor | simplest, repeatable test case |
| 18:05:57 | bobdaduck | Right |
| 18:06:31 | raptor | sure |
| 18:08:20 | bobdaduck | http://pastie.org/7303243 |
| 18:08:46 | bobdaduck | Loading this in the level editor will make the first forcefield snap to the other wall, and the second forcefield will fall off the wall. |
| 18:09:02 | bobdaduck | (so I advise going through hostgame to see what the level is supposed to be first) |
| 18:09:29 | raptor | ok |
| 18:09:49 | bobdaduck | This is on-level-loads-in-editor. |
| 18:11:08 | raptor | ok |
| 18:11:18 | raptor | hosted first |
| 18:11:23 | raptor | now loaded in editor |
| 18:11:29 | raptor | i see one FF broken? |
| 18:11:34 | raptor | the one inside the wall |
| 18:11:40 | raptor | is now below the wall |
| 18:11:43 | raptor | the other... |
| 18:12:03 | raptor | looks the same |
| 18:12:23 | bobdaduck | Is it going horizontal or vertical? |
| 18:12:28 | bobdaduck | When I placed it it was vertical. |
| 18:12:30 | raptor | vertical |
| 18:12:39 | raptor | but |
| 18:12:52 | raptor | I can see how it may load horizontally |
| 18:13:08 | bobdaduck | Huh |
| 18:13:15 | bobdaduck | it was consistently going horizontal for me on level load |
| 18:13:34 | bobdaduck | Maybe because I extended the length of the barrier afterwards or.... |
| 18:13:48 | bobdaduck | ohhhhh |
| 18:13:51 | bobdaduck | okay |
| 18:13:51 | raptor | i did fix a couple of editor bugs.. but i don't remember when (before or after 018a) |
| 18:13:56 | bobdaduck | I see something |
| 18:14:14 | bobdaduck | Its moved slightly off of the grid |
| 18:14:33 | raptor | your FF inside the wall is... impossible to do with the editor? |
| 18:14:34 | bobdaduck | Do you see how its a step away from the wall? |
| 18:14:56 | raptor | yes |
| 18:15:35 | bobdaduck | I didn't place it like that |
| 18:15:46 | bobdaduck | http://pastie.org/7303300 |
| 18:16:03 | bobdaduck | Try re-copying this code (which I double checked to make sure was right) |
| 18:16:27 | raptor | ok |
| 18:16:29 | raptor | looking |
| 18:16:33 | raptor | FFis closer to the wall |
| 18:16:43 | raptor | editor has moved it |
| 18:17:00 | bobdaduck | ...yay? |
| 18:17:26 | bobdaduck | FF inside the wall is possible to do with the editor |
| 18:17:53 | bobdaduck | 'cause I just did. |
| 18:18:07 | bobdaduck | You place the forcefield without snapping. Like you did in Zap! |
| 18:18:20 | bobdaduck | so just mouse in the spot you want, and then F. And then don't touch it. |
| 18:18:25 | bobdaduck | Or load it in the editor ever again. |
| 18:18:51 | kaen | I don't know if I'd rather be raptor trying to fix this bug or me trying to vertically center a damn image within a div. |
| 18:19:24 | bobdaduck | xD |
| 18:22:44 | raptor | so are you suggesting that snapping not be enabled at all? |
| 18:26:15 | raptor | for whatever reason, it works in-game... |
| 18:27:13 | kaen | I think it's a problem with resnapAllEngineeredItems then |
| 18:27:22 | raptor | yes |
| 18:27:39 | raptor | ok well, i'll look closer when i'm tired late at night and can make good decisions |
| 18:27:45 | kaen | hehe |
| 18:35:08 | kaen | 11:35:28 up 9 days, 19:24, 6 users, load average: 1.38, 1.46, 1.36 |
| 18:35:21 | kaen | it's starting to act kind of funny... |
| 18:35:40 | kaen | and there are permanent graphical glitches from the last time gimp crashed |
| 18:35:47 | kaen | so I guess I'll restart my laptop |
| 18:35:53 | raptor | ha |
| 18:35:57 | bobdaduck | sorry back |
| 18:35:58 | bobdaduck | what? |
| 18:36:04 | kaen | back in a minute |
| 18:36:19 | | kaen Quit (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 18:37:02 | raptor | bobdaduck: also rotating stuff messes up snapping, to, correct? |
| 18:37:07 | raptor | *too |
| 18:37:10 | bobdaduck | Yeah |
| 18:37:41 | bobdaduck | I don't think its quite the same bug though |
| 18:38:17 | bobdaduck | I think |
| 18:38:24 | bobdaduck | Hm |
| 18:38:34 | | kaen has joined |
| 18:38:57 | bobdaduck | So in Zap!, objects were represented by squares or markers. The little turret T box you see when you press T in editor |
| 18:39:32 | bobdaduck | Er |
| 18:39:53 | bobdaduck | Well I dunno. Something about snapping happening to the snapped coordinates causing things to go crazy, rather than the original coordinates |
| 18:41:55 | bobdaduck | IGNORE ME. |
| 18:42:17 | bobdaduck | Go back to talking about bitfighter ships with extremely high wisdom rolls |
| 18:43:44 | bobdaduck | Kaen: add to the homepage on pelasiefdes "New maps" |
| 18:43:54 | kaen | will do, boss |
| 18:44:56 | bobdaduck | Or else I'M CUTTING YOUR PAY. |
| 18:46:14 | kaen | OH GOD NOT MY LUXURIOUS SALARY |
| 18:46:58 | raptor | I have leveled up in my LDAP-foo |
| 18:46:59 | bobdaduck | That's right. However, if you do well |
| 18:47:06 | bobdaduck | I will give you a treat. |
| 18:47:15 | bobdaduck | Like make you another level or something. |
| 18:47:28 | bobdaduck | grats raptor! |
| 18:47:32 | bobdaduck | What will you spend the points on? |
| 18:47:50 | raptor | charisma - I have to sell hg/git over svn now... |
| 18:48:17 | bobdaduck | good plan |
| 18:50:28 | kaen | git was written by the guy who wrote linux to be better than svn |
| 18:50:42 | kaen | svn was only written to be better than cvs |
| 18:50:55 | kaen | cvs was written as a series of shell scripts |
| 18:51:08 | kaen | I think there's an obvious hierarchy there. |
| 18:51:24 | bobdaduck | xD |
| 18:51:56 | raptor | haha |
| 18:52:17 | raptor | i remember the early days of git - shell/perl scripts everywhere |
| 18:52:26 | raptor | in fact... has that changed? |
| 18:52:41 | raptor | it's now just 'compiled' perl scripts? |
| 18:53:19 | raptor | best URL: https://github.com/git/git |
| 18:53:26 | kaen | I was just there :) |
| 18:53:35 | raptor | oh good, lots of C now |
| 18:53:45 | raptor | there's the sh! |
| 18:55:36 | raptor | I have to say that the new generation of python-based DVCS (hg, bzr, etc.) makes hacking *really* easy |
| 19:01:24 | | LordDVG has joined |
| 19:03:14 | kaen | got to love a good scripting interface... |
| 19:09:19 | bobdaduck | If I design my own ship with the scripting whatnot and everything, can I tie it to my account and use it exclusively? |
| 19:12:32 | kaen | what? |
| 19:13:00 | bobdaduck | Ship shapes. |
| 19:13:12 | bobdaduck | If I make my own and then tie it to my account would you guys let me get away with that? |
| 19:14:29 | raptor | that thread was finally killed right? |
| 19:14:33 | kaen | yes |
| 19:14:35 | bobdaduck | yeah |
| 19:14:36 | bobdaduck | xD |
| 19:15:02 | bobdaduck | And the forums haven't seen a new post in DAYS |
| 19:15:05 | bobdaduck | COINCIDENCE? |
| 19:17:41 | raptor | mission accomplished! |
| 19:17:55 | bobdaduck | You fixed the snapping bug? |
| 19:18:08 | raptor | (it's good to not know about off-topic) |
| 19:24:06 | raptor | i told you I'll do it when I don't have the brain-power |
| 19:25:33 | bobdaduck | xD |
| 19:26:17 | raptor | I've also been hesitant to do this one because it may involve an algorithmic bug in the grid database... and that's... probably going to be really hard to find |
| 19:27:42 | bobdaduck | algorithmic? |
| 19:29:17 | kaen | that would be an even deeper and uglier bug than I first thought |
| 19:32:15 | raptor | a big word I invented to make it sound scary |
| 19:35:07 | kaen | any thoughts on when to release pleiades? first: what general features are still lacking before it's ready. second: do we want to synchronize the releases? |
| 19:35:47 | kaen | (the releases of pleiades and the next version of bitfighter, I mean) |
| 19:36:17 | raptor | I think it should be released when 019 comes out - to add to the 'wow' factor |
| 19:36:19 | raptor | :) |
| 19:36:46 | raptor | but its looking really good... |
| 19:36:53 | bobdaduck | Yeah |
| 19:37:48 | raptor | can I upload a map (as an admin) for someone else yet? |
| 19:38:13 | kaen | not yet. I'm wrestling with how to do it exactly |
| 19:38:35 | raptor | my 'home' and 'view all levels' show different mounts of maps |
| 19:39:01 | kaen | 'home' is a top 8 from two categories (right now) |
| 19:39:05 | kaen | and view all levels is broken |
| 19:39:25 | bobdaduck | So... view all levels should be fixed before release xD |
| 19:39:27 | kaen | it's just a debug feature which will go away when search gets done |
| 19:39:53 | kaen | oh god... search |
| 19:39:59 | bobdaduck | xD |
| 19:40:00 | kaen | leviathan. |
| 19:40:10 | raptor | i *hate* programming search stuff |
| 19:40:14 | kaen | about to wake from his 10,000 year slumber |
| 19:40:24 | raptor | I've had to do it at work, and I've always loathed it |
| 19:40:37 | raptor | one algorithm to get everyones preferences correct |
| 19:40:50 | raptor | grrr! |
| 19:41:03 | kaen | grrr! indeed |
| 19:42:00 | kaen | okay, so as an admin I upload a map for an MIA author |
| 19:42:14 | kaen | how is that map displayed in relation to other maps? |
| 19:42:31 | kaen | what do I put in the "author" area? |
| 19:43:12 | kaen | oh man and now I have to add an extra credited_author field or something... |
| 19:43:23 | kaen | because it populates that from the associated forum account right now. |
| 19:43:47 | kaen | which not all map authors have :/ |
| 19:49:09 | raptor | that's why I originally thought you pulled teh LevelCredits line |
| 19:49:45 | raptor | so yes, we'd need a separate author field from 'uploader', but they would always be the same except for a few folks who'd have the power to change it |
| 19:50:06 | raptor | maybe show that field to the admins, and prepopulate it with their own name |
| 19:50:08 | bobdaduck | if the user is a mod, show a field for editing the thingy |
| 19:53:32 | kaen | wow I haven't looked at the RBL for a while... |
| 19:53:37 | kaen | where'd it all come from!? |
| 19:54:48 | raptor | realtime blackhole list? |
| 19:55:01 | kaen | ooooh that makes sense now |
| 19:55:38 | kaen | because of its gargantuan mass it is influencing the trajectory of other bugs via gravity |
| 19:55:53 | kaen | and attracting them to it, thereby increasing its mass ever more |
| 19:55:54 | raptor | haha. i like that analogy! |
| 19:56:18 | kaen | but yes I meant the bug list |
| 19:56:41 | kaen | I'll have thank quartz for all the bug hunting he's apparently done... |
| 19:57:14 | bobdaduck | xD |
| 19:57:17 | raptor | ohhhh.. the running bug list |
| 19:57:22 | raptor | now that makes sense... |
| 19:57:27 | raptor | yeah umm |
| 19:57:32 | bobdaduck | the bug hunting he's done for the sole purpose of crashing kaen test |
| 19:57:32 | raptor | it's so large! |
| 19:58:36 | bobdaduck | xD |
| 19:58:38 | bobdaduck | *looks* |
| 19:59:15 | bobdaduck | !bug |
| 19:59:15 | BFLogBot | To enter a bug, please make sure it is reproducible and then go to http://code.google.com/p/bitfighter/issues/list | Also, see current running bug list: http://bitfighter.org/wiki/index.php/Running_Bug_List |
| 19:59:29 | bobdaduck | HOLY CRAP |
| 19:59:36 | bobdaduck | EXPLITIVES EVERYWHERE |
| 20:00:09 | bobdaduck | turrent |
| 20:00:38 | bobdaduck | lol I have my own section |
| 20:01:06 | raptor | yeah yeah turrent |
| 20:01:24 | | LordDVG Quit (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 20:01:47 | raptor | bobdaduck: your section should be larger, but you were giving out bugs faster than I could think one night... |
| 20:01:55 | bobdaduck | xD |
| 20:02:14 | raptor | i remember you mentioning about 3 or 4, but only remembered one when writing them down.. |
| 20:02:55 | bobdaduck | I just have all these ideas... |
| 20:03:25 | bobdaduck | Still trying to figure out that levelgen carnival crash |
| 20:03:35 | bobdaduck | Apocalypse button disabled for the moment to see if that fixes it |
| 20:03:41 | raptor | oh |
| 20:03:43 | raptor | actually |
| 20:03:52 | raptor | we determined it was a memory corruption, right? |
| 20:03:54 | raptor | because... |
| 20:04:05 | raptor | the slipzones only do weird things for you, not me.. |
| 20:04:11 | raptor | (or Quartz) |
| 20:04:39 | bobdaduck | *maybe*. |
| 20:04:43 | | Watusimoto has joined |
| 20:04:47 | bobdaduck | It might be how excessively levelgen'd the level is. |
| 20:05:04 | Watusimoto | hi |
| 20:05:05 | raptor | well yes, but if it creates a memory corruption, we need to fix it |
| 20:05:09 | raptor | hi Watusimoto |
| 20:05:13 | bobdaduck | hi |
| 20:05:33 | bobdaduck | You should probably test slipzones in 019 |
| 20:05:42 | bobdaduck | to see if its a memory corruption? |
| 20:05:45 | Watusimoto | do we really still want those? |
| 20:05:52 | raptor | bobdaduck: i'm telling you - you're the crazy one |
| 20:05:58 | raptor | but we need to duplicate it somehow |
| 20:06:02 | bobdaduck | xD |
| 20:06:14 | bobdaduck | We want them exclusively so that we can have race tracks. |
| 20:06:30 | bobdaduck | I don't think anyone remembers they exist often enough to put them in actual levels. |
| 20:06:36 | bobdaduck | I bet someone could use them well though. |
| 20:06:41 | bobdaduck | Just hasn't happened yet. |
| 20:06:43 | bobdaduck | /engineer |
| 20:06:46 | bobdaduck | /levelgens |
| 20:06:53 | bobdaduck | /everything |
| 20:07:07 | bobdaduck | I'm heading out |
| 20:07:33 | bobdaduck | PEACE HOMIES |
| 20:07:37 | | bobdaduck Quit (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 20:07:52 | Watusimoto | I wonder about engineering a slipzone |
| 20:08:18 | Watusimoto | just tossing the idea around |
| 20:08:21 | raptor | slipzone mines |
| 20:08:27 | Watusimoto | could be an interesting defence |
| 20:08:35 | Watusimoto | inertial disruptors |
| 20:09:13 | Watusimoto | or navigational disruptors that make you travel at 90 degrees to the direction you aim |
| 20:09:20 | raptor | haha! |
| 20:10:00 | raptor | reminds me of the game 'eittris' (my favorite tetris clone) that did that to your keys |
| 20:24:20 | Watusimoto | in college we would add challenge to tetris by letting people harass the players. my friend inserted the ear of one player into a stapler and said... "am I making you nervous?" his game ended shortly thereafter |
| 20:25:30 | raptor | haha |
| 21:09:40 | kaen | well #cakephp is absolutely useless |
| 21:10:09 | kaen | I asked a conceptual question about using authentication logic inside of a model |
| 21:10:33 | kaen | and ended up answering questions about time formatting and string manipulation |
| 21:10:55 | kaen | didn't even get an answer except someone told me "no" |
| 21:11:01 | kaen | and then /part ed |
| 21:12:28 | | koda has joined |
| 21:13:55 | kaen | I also posted a question on ask.cakephp.org regarding a weird error that only occurs in test mode (which I believe to be a bug in cakephp). not a single response. |
| 21:38:07 | Watusimoto | with our new font system we can use dingbats as badges |
| 21:46:16 | raptor | kaen: yay for 'supported' software! |
| 21:46:25 | raptor | also dingbats... hmmm |
| 21:46:55 | kaen | ❦ please |
| 21:47:06 | raptor | what is that? |
| 21:47:18 | kaen | a fleuron |
| 21:47:29 | kaen | iirc there are horizontal ones too |
| 21:48:34 | kaen | assuming the bitfighter is utf capable |
| 21:48:39 | kaen | that* |
| 21:48:55 | raptor | we are up to the first 255 chars or so :) |
| 21:49:22 | Watusimoto | well, 32-128, mostly |
| 21:49:30 | raptor | wow fleuron fonts are nuts |
| 21:50:32 | kaen | I didn't know there were entire fonts o.o |
| 21:52:17 | Watusimoto | interesting |
| 21:52:37 | Watusimoto | so we have a bit of a problem with the new font and using it to display the time |
| 21:52:54 | Watusimoto | currently, we right-align the elements in the display in the lower-right |
| 21:53:05 | Watusimoto | it sort of works with roman, with a 5 pixel fudge factor |
| 21:53:33 | Watusimoto | but with tenby5, the 1 glyph is radically narrower than the other digits |
| 21:53:40 | Watusimoto | so the right-align won't work |
| 21:53:56 | Watusimoto | because we align the text once, and don't shift it as the digits change |
| 21:54:07 | Watusimoto | to avoid the effect of the numbers skipping around every second |
| 21:54:19 | Watusimoto | so when the time ends in 1 in tenby, the alingment looks awful |
| 21:54:44 | Watusimoto | the easiest solution would be to use a mono-spaced font for teh time display |
| 21:54:48 | kaen | yes |
| 21:55:06 | Watusimoto | I've been experimenting with various lcd fonts, but I'm not really happy with the results |
| 21:55:19 | Watusimoto | they seem like they should look good with our display, but really they don't |
| 21:55:28 | kaen | I wouldn't use those for a game info display anyway |
| 21:55:36 | kaen | unless they were extraordinarily readable |
| 21:55:41 | Watusimoto | it's readable |
| 21:56:08 | Watusimoto | http://img16.imageshack.us/img16/8537/screenshot24uh.png |
| 21:56:35 | Watusimoto | I'm talking about the digits only. the rest would be in tenby, so pretend you can read it |
| 21:56:36 | raptor | not the dreaded alarm clock! |
| 21:56:40 | kaen | I was thinking you meant like dot matrix ones |
| 21:56:52 | Watusimoto | hard to find readable versions of that |
| 21:56:55 | kaen | right |
| 21:57:07 | Watusimoto | but... no, not the dreaded alarm clock |
| 21:57:18 | Watusimoto | a great font name for one of those fonts would be 6AM |
| 21:57:30 | kaen | haha |
| 21:57:34 | Watusimoto | not that the world needs another alarm clock font |
| 21:57:45 | kaen | you two really don't like the way that looks? |
| 21:57:55 | kaen | if it were just the digit's it'd be great imo |
| 21:58:00 | kaen | maybe a few points smaller though |
| 21:58:10 | Watusimoto | I can make it just the digits so we can see |
| 21:58:48 | raptor | just timer might be OK - unless it starts giving me anxiety |
| 21:59:54 | Watusimoto | I will say that 6AM looks better than ocra |
| 22:00:28 | raptor | link to that font? |
| 22:01:35 | Watusimoto | http://img138.imageshack.us/img138/666/screenshot25vr.png |
| 22:01:44 | Watusimoto | which? |
| 22:01:56 | raptor | the 6am one (or the similar) |
| 22:02:06 | raptor | also the loadout graphic is nice |
| 22:02:17 | Watusimoto | I like it too! |
| 22:02:49 | Watusimoto | http://www.fontspace.com/category/lcd?p=9 |
| 22:02:52 | Watusimoto | digitial |
| 22:02:56 | Watusimoto | is the one I'm using here |
| 22:03:06 | Watusimoto | I tried some others and the 7s were all funky |
| 22:04:17 | kaen | looks great with game mode in the regular font |
| 22:05:11 | | Platskies has joined |
| 22:15:36 | | Platskies Quit (Ping timeout: 256 seconds) |
| 22:17:04 | raptor | the 7 is funky using the left line |
| 22:18:08 | Watusimoto | http://img15.imageshack.us/img15/8260/screenshot26lp.png |
| 22:18:24 | Watusimoto | this one has the player score in 6AM as well, but you can't really see it |
| 22:18:57 | Watusimoto | and it may be better to use the regular font in a different color or something |
| 22:20:58 | raptor | a slightly brighter color for the leaderboard might be good |
| 22:21:27 | Watusimoto | a brighter shade of red? |
| 22:21:30 | raptor | sure |
| 22:22:08 | raptor | i cannot possibly see how the font 'Romance fatal LCD' could be used in anything |
| 22:24:22 | | Platskies has joined |
| 22:25:49 | Watusimoto | http://img138.imageshack.us/img138/9038/screenshot27i.png |
| 22:26:07 | Watusimoto | I tried even lighter, but it just looked washed out |
| 22:27:37 | raptor | i read it as 'Watusimot0' |
| 22:28:05 | raptor | but it looks easier to read |
| 22:36:32 | | Platskies Quit (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 22:41:33 | Watusimoto | ok, new idea.. |
| 22:41:59 | Watusimoto | I don't really like the alarm clock font |
| 22:42:04 | Watusimoto | it reminds me I need to get up tomorrow |
| 22:42:05 | raptor | yay |
| 22:42:07 | Watusimoto | and I don;t like that |
| 22:42:16 | Watusimoto | but the problem is right-alignment |
| 22:42:31 | Watusimoto | i also want to avoid going overboard on the fonts just yet |
| 22:42:41 | Watusimoto | so here's a way to resolve the alignment with tenby |
| 22:42:43 | Watusimoto | http://img69.imageshack.us/img69/4678/screenshot28gy.png |
| 22:44:50 | Watusimoto | the same thing with grayer box, showing the font when there's lots of 1s in it (so it gets a bit scrunched) |
| 22:44:51 | Watusimoto | http://img198.imageshack.us/img198/6571/screenshot29z.png |
| 22:46:46 | raptor | oh wow |
| 22:47:01 | kaen | what if you printed three strings in the box, one for minutes, one for the colon, one for seconds |
| 22:47:24 | kaen | the colon never moves that way. |
| 22:47:44 | kaen | or actually just two: minutes, then colon + seconds |
| 22:47:49 | Watusimoto | I thought about that... maybe |
| 22:48:10 | Watusimoto | also, I could adjust the width of the display every minute, so as we get into narrow minutes, things never get too far out of whack |
| 22:48:33 | Watusimoto | I'm playing with the alignment of the elements aroudn the box as well |
| 22:48:45 | kaen | both of these seem like much more work than using a fixed font :) |
| 22:49:30 | Watusimoto | but more work than finidng a good fixed font? |
| 22:49:50 | kaen | I mean it's five characters in the bottom right of the screen |
| 22:51:32 | Watusimoto | hey, don't go trying to inject a note of reason here |
| 22:51:39 | Watusimoto | that's not what this is about! |
| 22:51:47 | raptor | what about people who play dungeons for 120 minutes? |
| 22:52:03 | raptor | ahem sky_lark |
| 22:53:08 | Watusimoto | I'll resize the box every minute |
| 22:53:29 | raptor | :) |
| 22:54:31 | kaen | this looks not bad at 12 point with only digits and a colon: http://www.fontsquirrel.com/fonts/oxygen-mono |
| 22:54:41 | kaen | I imagine I'll post something you've looked before though |
| 22:54:55 | kaen | sounds like you've been in font hell for eons now |
| 22:55:49 | raptor | wow, that's a polished font |
| 22:56:11 | raptor | oh wait, I think that's what I'm using in my KDE konsole |
| 22:56:27 | kaen | it's made by the KDE project |
| 22:56:38 | kaen | Oxygen is their foundry |
| 22:56:48 | raptor | ha, yep |
| 22:57:09 | Watusimoto | radical alignment |
| 22:57:12 | Watusimoto | http://img705.imageshack.us/img705/9836/screenshot30v.png |
| 22:57:22 | Watusimoto | not sure I dig that last one |
| 22:57:40 | kaen | the one you just posted? |
| 22:57:43 | kaen | I think it looks great. |
| 22:57:47 | Watusimoto | yes |
| 22:57:57 | Watusimoto | one thing about oxygen is that it has a passing resemblance to tenby, so it might not add too much font clutter |
| 23:00:20 | Watusimoto | then yoyu might like this next one |
| 23:00:28 | Watusimoto | coming in a couple of mins |
| 23:00:49 | raptor | use oxygen everywhere? |
| 23:01:14 | raptor | but then we're back to nice, easy to read fonts, instead of thematic ones |
| 23:02:26 | Watusimoto | http://img138.imageshack.us/img138/6301/screenshot31g.png |
| 23:02:41 | raptor | *gasp* |
| 23:02:49 | Watusimoto | fixed width fonts get too wide for widespread use |
| 23:02:56 | raptor | that doesn't look half bad |
| 23:03:04 | Watusimoto | you can swap in ocra everywhere and you'll see the problem |
| 23:03:30 | raptor | normal oxygen: http://www.fontsquirrel.com/fonts/oxygen |
| 23:04:16 | Watusimoto | tenby is already unspacy enough |
| 23:04:23 | Watusimoto | oxygen is pleasant, but worse |
| 23:07:27 | raptor | we could throw up our hands and just use this: we could throw up our hands and just |
| 23:07:30 | raptor | oops |
| 23:07:33 | raptor | http://www.fontsquirrel.com/fonts/Windsong |
| 23:08:17 | Watusimoto | Here is the same display, but with a flag game. I have not adjusted the flag display in any way, but it looks pretty good with the box |
| 23:08:17 | Watusimoto | http://img546.imageshack.us/img546/8876/screenshot32y.png |
| 23:08:45 | Watusimoto | so... windsong looks pretty good. Maybe for the chatting font? |
| 23:08:57 | raptor | yes, but only when certain players are speaking |
| 23:09:12 | Watusimoto | Dear xxxxxx, why are you so cruel? |
| 23:09:18 | raptor | haha |
| 23:09:23 | | SolumnMus has joined |
| 23:09:40 | Watusimoto | fill in xxxxx as you see fit |
| 23:10:12 | Watusimoto | so should we keep the box? |
| 23:10:30 | | fordcars has joined |
| 23:10:42 | Watusimoto | or too early to tell yet? |
| 23:10:55 | SolumnMus | Woo! openSUSE seems to be working better than anything else! |
| 23:11:14 | Watusimoto | let me rephrase... should I make the box not be a horrible hack? |
| 23:12:49 | | SolumnMus Quit (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 23:13:17 | Watusimoto | ok, it's nearly bed time, so I'm going to do no more work on this tonight, to give things time to stew |
| 23:13:20 | raptor | I honestly think I'll live with whatever... |
| 23:13:26 | Watusimoto | of course you will! |
| 23:13:32 | raptor | as long as my brain can absorb it fast enough |
| 23:13:52 | raptor | if not, then I might die |
| 23:13:55 | fordcars | yay for fonts |
| 23:14:12 | Watusimoto | fordcars: did you see the graphics I posted earlier in this chat |
| 23:14:38 | Watusimoto | http://img546.imageshack.us/img546/8876/screenshot32y.png |
| 23:14:45 | Watusimoto | take a look at that one and tell me what you think |
| 23:14:50 | fordcars | I saw a few image shack alarm clock style fonts, yes :) |
| 23:15:14 | Watusimoto | i decided I don't like the alarm clock ones |
| 23:15:25 | fordcars | ok :P |
| 23:15:33 | fordcars | yeah, it's nice! |
| 23:15:57 | fordcars | are you using kaens shaders for this? |
| 23:17:01 | raptor | Watusimoto: or maybe in this structure (ignore colors): http://www.twiddla.com/1140040 |
| 23:17:28 | Watusimoto | fordcars: no |
| 23:17:36 | fordcars | ok |
| 23:18:06 | fordcars | but still vector graphics, right? |
| 23:18:15 | raptor | nope :) |
| 23:18:24 | Watusimoto | not for the new text |
| 23:18:33 | fordcars | heh |
| 23:18:38 | Watusimoto | for the graphics, yes, nothing is changing |
| 23:19:06 | Watusimoto | raptor: that looks good |
| 23:19:22 | raptor | something similar... minimalist |
| 23:19:24 | fordcars | the graphics: Are you talking about the wider lines? |
| 23:19:29 | Watusimoto | the one problem I see is that the time will have to be larger to accomodate the two rows of rab/50 text |
| 23:19:37 | raptor | yes |
| 23:19:47 | raptor | but maybe it can be the same row still |
| 23:19:54 | Watusimoto | the latest display I produced the box lets you get smaller text |
| 23:20:05 | Watusimoto | but I do like that |
| 23:20:11 | raptor | but section dividers allow easier separation without redundant lines |
| 23:20:21 | Watusimoto | yes |
| 23:20:47 | Watusimoto | and the wider horizontal provides a solid "base" for the flags to sit on in the ctf display |
| 23:21:15 | fordcars | oh sorry yes ok, good job watusimoto! |
| 23:22:27 | Watusimoto | fordcars: to answer your earlier q, all we're changing is the text and the loadout menu rendering at the moment |
| 23:22:35 | Watusimoto | none of the core game elements |
| 23:22:58 | Watusimoto | escept perhaps how zones are labeled (using a graphic for loadout zones at the moment) |
| 23:23:14 | Watusimoto | but trying hard not to change the flavor of the game |
| 23:24:04 | raptor | too late! |
| 23:24:06 | fordcars | yep, well it feels good to have a little more modern looking fonts |
| 23:24:14 | raptor | game flavor changed with UI! |
| 23:24:19 | fordcars | heh |
| 23:36:49 | Watusimoto | http://img594.imageshack.us/img594/3876/screenshot34j.png |
| 23:37:41 | fordcars | nice |
| 23:37:54 | raptor | looking nicer! |
| 23:37:57 | fordcars | it's better than the box, I think |
| 23:38:13 | raptor | i imagine the intersection would be hard to get just right.. |
| 23:38:22 | fordcars | yeah |
| 23:38:34 | Watusimoto | no |
| 23:38:53 | Watusimoto | it was just sloppy because I'm going fast; this will all need to be rewritten properly |
| 23:39:37 | Watusimoto | I'm using random numbers rather than variables and comutation |
| 23:40:26 | raptor | cool |
| 23:40:39 | Watusimoto | http://img11.imageshack.us/img11/8467/screenshot35kk.png |
| 23:40:55 | Watusimoto | with a deliberate gap btwn the lines |
| 23:42:54 | Watusimoto | and leaderboard style display |
| 23:43:00 | Watusimoto | http://img163.imageshack.us/img163/8769/screenshot36l.png |
| 23:43:44 | raptor | seems ok |
| 23:44:12 | raptor | maybe Ret 50 should be on the same line... the disparity is starting to look off |
| 23:44:27 | Watusimoto | not sure if I prefer the box or not, but both of these ideas resolve the right-align issue nicely |
| 23:44:31 | raptor | it would need to be at least as small as the timer |
| 23:44:42 | raptor | with total vertical |
| 23:45:02 | Watusimoto | ok, will try one more before bed |
| 23:51:47 | Watusimoto | http://img692.imageshack.us/img692/2797/screenshot37m.png |
| 23:52:21 | raptor | hmmm |
| 23:52:22 | Watusimoto | maybe centering the watusimoto on top of the line would help? |
| 23:52:41 | raptor | yes but different players have different named lengths |
| 23:53:05 | raptor | I think that last one is close |
| 23:53:08 | Watusimoto | with flags |
| 23:53:09 | Watusimoto | http://img40.imageshack.us/img40/9702/screenshot38v.png |
| 23:53:25 | Watusimoto | yes, I'd right align all the names and center the block |
| 23:53:33 | raptor | pretty clean |
| 23:54:03 | raptor | kaen? what do you think |
| 23:54:25 | fordcars | I like itè |
| 23:54:46 | Watusimoto | I'm coming around to the lines, as opposed to the box |
| 23:54:59 | Watusimoto | still thinking I like the stacked rab/50 though... |
| 23:55:04 | Watusimoto | but not sure |
| 23:55:12 | Watusimoto | kaen is sick of this |
| 23:55:17 | raptor | heh |
| 23:55:55 | raptor | yeah I like the stacked a bit more |
| 23:56:26 | raptor | but the unevenness bugs me a bit |
| 23:56:36 | Watusimoto | which unevenness? |
| 23:56:54 | raptor | the total vertical of the stacked 'Rab 50' vs the total vertical of the timer |
| 23:57:58 | Watusimoto | so the timer should be taller? i.e. timer top and bottom of timer should align with top and bottom of stack? |
| 23:59:20 | raptor | they should just about match, but screen real estate usage is important.. |
| 23:59:29 | raptor | so i don't know which to make taller/smaller |
| 23:59:39 | Watusimoto | ok, just wanted to understand what you meant |
| 23:59:54 | Watusimoto | I'll try some stuff tomorrow |
| 23:59:59 | Watusimoto | I have some ideas |
