#bitfighter IRC Log

IRC Log for 2013-06-10

Timestamps are in GMT/BST.

00:56:31 koda has joined
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07:23:16 koda yo
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08:35:42 raptor On breifly
08:35:46 raptor it's a girl!
08:36:09 raptor ok bye
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08:41:48 bobdaduck !!!!
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09:24:06 bobdaduck buildbot noooo
10:31:59 koda hey kaen how's the cmake thing going?
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11:25:30 bobdaduck !!!!
11:25:41 raptor so tired...
11:26:11 bobdaduck Is baby?
11:26:15 raptor also, girl babies look exactly like babies..  I don't know why I thought it might be different
11:26:22 raptor * like boy
11:26:35 raptor (in general)
11:26:41 raptor they still look like naked mole rats
11:27:02 bobdaduck xD
11:27:10 bobdaduck grats!
11:27:13 raptor thanks!
11:29:28 bobdaduck So now I need to fix something that I liked better broken
11:29:46 bobdaduck Picking up loot bags yields more gold than the loot bag should have in it.
11:30:02 raptor math error
11:30:15 raptor oh hey, our evangelist is back..
11:35:22 kaen indeed.
11:35:29 kaen hello all, and congratulations raptor
11:35:32 raptor hi
11:35:35 raptor and thanks!
11:38:32 bobdaduck Yeah I know its a math error
11:38:47 bobdaduck But I kind of liked the mechanic but, as the party showed, its too abusable.
11:38:54 bobdaduck Kaen did you get any crash logs that night at all?
11:39:56 kaen nope.
11:40:43 kaen the crashes were all because my host was killing the bitfighter process
11:41:00 kaen because the ram kept climbing to over 600MB
11:41:25 kaen and it put me over my allowed peak RAM usage :P
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11:47:10 raptor ha
11:49:11 bobdaduck xD
11:50:53 kaen I was thinking, if the userdata you get for a single object between each occurrence of an event callback are not equal to each other, doesn't that mean that luaW is creating a new userdata for each one?
11:51:05 raptor it is
11:51:09 raptor that's the leak
11:51:09 kaen ah
11:51:19 kaen I never realized how it would scale...
11:51:39 raptor we disabled the luaW clean up because it was cleaning up object that it shouldn't be and we'd get reandom script crashes
11:51:43 raptor that was the 'fix'
11:52:07 bobdaduck Wait what?
11:52:11 raptor yeah, well - we didn't seem to think it would be that big of an issue..
11:52:35 raptor then bobdaduck makes a level to break our assumptions..
11:52:49 kaen a familiar feeling.
11:52:55 raptor yes
11:53:02 bobdaduck I'm nearly sorry!
11:57:58 raptor so I have two major issues with luajit-vec
11:58:03 raptor one it the -vec part
11:58:07 raptor the other is the jit part
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12:00:56 bobdaduck So what can I do to optimize dnd?
12:05:05 raptor you might be stuck for now..
12:07:03 bobdaduck cool
12:11:43 bobdaduck could someone do a logic examination on this code?
12:11:46 bobdaduck http://pastie.org/8031397
12:12:06 bobdaduck people currently picking up way more gold than was originally dropped.
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14:08:06 bobdaduck fixed!
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14:58:52 bobdaduck Welcome back
14:58:54 bobdaduck Congrats on the baby again
14:58:56 raptor hi
14:58:59 raptor thanks
14:59:29 raptor i may be somewhat lower intelligence for the next few days because of sleep deprivation...  but maybe you won't notice a thing :)
14:59:55 raptor so forgive me if the obvious may not be so obvious to me at times
15:00:44 bobdaduck lol
15:00:49 bobdaduck Forgiven in advance
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15:16:30 Watusimoto good evening
15:17:04 bobdaduck Even'nin
15:18:56 Watusimoto raptor, kaen, anyone else: Just to let you know I have a business meeting this week, so will only be on intermittently. I won't really be back until Sunday evening.  I leave in the morning.
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15:31:18 raptor hi Watusimoto
15:31:26 Watusimoto hi
15:31:59 raptor that's ok, we'll make sure DnD becomes a permanent part of the game..
15:32:04 Watusimoto I was just looking back at the tests i wrote last night... very voluminous
15:32:10 Watusimoto excellent!
15:32:21 raptor the game is in good hands..
15:32:27 raptor oh, i should check that..
15:32:29 Watusimoto indeed it is
15:32:53 raptor oh wow, lots of test
15:32:58 koda hi all
15:33:02 raptor hi koda
15:33:35 Watusimoto if you are interested in the details of the timing of what happens when, it's all there... timed down to the ms
15:33:41 Watusimoto hi koda\
15:34:11 bobdaduck_ DnD will soon have its own dedicated server
15:34:47 koda raptor: i read your 'it's a girl' message so i think what it is
15:34:52 koda raptor: congratulations \o/
15:35:06 raptor so if we wanted to do luajit (without lua-vec), we'd have to provide lua replacements for the point object and methods (like dot, distSquared, etc.) AND replace our (very few) calls to luaL_pushVec, luaL_tovec, etc.
15:35:14 raptor thanks koda!
15:35:25 Watusimoto you had a girl?
15:35:29 raptor yes
15:35:34 Watusimoto congratulations!!!
15:35:48 raptor my older coworkers curses came true..
15:35:52 raptor thanks!
15:36:04 koda what's her name?
15:36:10 Watusimoto raptor: yes
15:36:11 raptor Katherine
15:36:34 Watusimoto Great name!
15:37:02 raptor the wife chose it..  I honestly had no real idea what a good girl's name would be..
15:37:31 Watusimoto I think girls names are easier than boys...  that's what we found when looking for names
15:38:05 Watusimoto I was arguing for Calvin, but my wife said we'd be doomed if we chose that name
15:38:11 raptor hahaha
15:38:35 raptor I've always wondered how much a name could shape a personality in a child..
15:38:58 Watusimoto I'm sure it has some effect, but probably less than other factors
15:39:26 Watusimoto I saw a study on tha trecently, actually
15:40:22 Watusimoto there is also a section on names in the Freakanomics movie
15:40:53 Watusimoto they researched response rates to identical resumes sent from "John" and "Tyrone"
15:40:58 Watusimoto or somesuch
15:41:05 raptor haha
15:41:14 Watusimoto with predictable outcome
15:41:38 raptor well, there's the obvious effect - like my last name ended up rhyming really well in high school...
15:42:03 Watusimoto raptor must flaptor his wings!
15:42:08 raptor haha
15:42:11 Watusimoto craptor raptor
15:42:31 raptor haha
15:42:31 Watusimoto I will NOT be naming my thrid child "craptor"
15:43:03 Nothing_Much Hello
15:43:43 raptor hi
15:43:48 Nothing_Much what's up?
15:44:13 Nothing_Much oh my
15:44:15 raptor actually, maybe everything rhymes with something..
15:44:23 Watusimoto not true
15:44:30 Watusimoto "orange"
15:44:35 raptor in some way, in high school..
15:44:37 Nothing_Much and purple
15:44:50 raptor orange you going open the door?
15:45:26 raptor orange you going to catch that frisbee??
15:45:52 Watusimoto orange you ugly?
15:45:57 bobdaduck_ lol
15:46:05 raptor haha
15:46:10 Watusimoto c'mon... it's high school... open the door?
15:46:27 raptor let's just say that maybe it was more my personality that got me picked on..
15:46:58 Watusimoto high school can be a brutal time
15:47:09 raptor that's why i left after junior year!
15:47:19 Watusimoto off to work in the mills?
15:47:37 raptor it had nothing left to offer
15:47:43 raptor i went to college instead
15:47:53 raptor and i'm still there!
15:47:55 raptor sigh
15:48:00 Watusimoto some of my friends did the same
15:48:06 Nothing_Much you can go to college without finishing high school?
15:48:11 bobdaduck_ yeah
15:48:20 raptor yep
15:48:25 Nothing_Much interesting
15:48:30 bobdaduck_ Its harder to get into a good college (I think?) but colleges can do whatever they want
15:48:38 raptor and i would highly recommend it to anyone who thinks high was as stupid as I did
15:48:49 raptor *high school
15:48:54 Nothing_Much finished high school, can't finish college atm :(
15:48:56 bobdaduck_ I enjoyed high school except for the school part
15:49:35 raptor my problem was, though, that i loved the learning but i hated the social part - not because i was bad (I was) but because i saw it as a tremendous waste of time and energy (and it was)
15:49:55 bobdaduck_ I was the opposite
15:50:05 Watusimoto I have to disagree with you there... some of my closest friends were my friends from high school
15:50:14 bobdaduck_ I hated the learning (I already knew everything) but I loved the social part
15:50:25 raptor Watusimoto: high school in the west or east?
15:50:31 Watusimoto Boston!
15:50:32 Nothing_Much I have to say that high school was the only school I ever made friends with
15:50:58 Watusimoto well, Arlington, but close enough
15:51:09 raptor so i made closer, but fewer friends in the east, but lots more enemies
15:51:13 Nothing_Much mostly because people wanted to see why I was so shy
15:51:22 Watusimoto but then, I was pretty fortunate in the group of people who were there then
15:51:46 raptor than in thw west, i mean
15:53:33 Watusimoto a lot of it is luck, I think... you either have a good combination of personalities, or a bad one
15:54:11 raptor well, i went to a lot of different schools in different towns on the east coast, growing up
15:54:21 raptor either I had constant bad luck, or just the wrong personality
15:54:36 Watusimoto it's harder being the new kid
15:54:39 raptor probably being both
15:54:47 raptor yeah that was a big part of it i'm sure
15:55:13 Watusimoto i went to the same schools, with mostly the same people, from K-12
15:55:19 raptor what!>?
15:55:28 raptor i can't even fathom what that would be like..
15:55:46 Watusimoto of my 4 best friends, I knew two of them from 3rd grade (well, one was my best friend in k)
15:55:53 Watusimoto or maybe 1st grade
15:56:00 Watusimoto two others I met in hs
15:56:05 raptor wow
15:56:07 raptor that's cool
15:56:11 raptor and still friends?
15:56:14 Watusimoto yes
15:56:36 Watusimoto one lives just up the street from me in the us, though I don't see him all that often
15:58:14 Watusimoto but my brother, in similar cicrumstances, had a nearly opposite outcome
15:58:21 raptor :(
15:58:34 Watusimoto which I attribute mostly to personalities
15:58:56 raptor i'd like to think that i'm mostly over high school atrocities...  except for raging against how stupid it was  :)
15:58:56 Watusimoto the combined assemblage of personalities, that is
15:59:14 Watusimoto yeah, well... who wasn't?
16:00:20 Watusimoto hs reunions can be very interesting
16:00:26 raptor never been to one
16:00:33 Watusimoto you should go!
16:00:35 raptor too many highschools..
16:00:43 raptor you think?
16:00:53 Watusimoto I thought they would be totally lame... but it turned out that they were rather interesting
16:01:02 Watusimoto it, not they
16:01:07 Watusimoto only went to one
16:01:17 raptor i would probably find them interesting in an intellictual-glad-i-didn't-make-those-choices sort of way
16:01:28 Watusimoto that's part of it :-)
16:01:32 raptor heh
16:01:44 Watusimoto just interesting to see how people turned out... what did they do with themselves?
16:02:26 Watusimoto kind of like reading the end of a book
16:02:32 raptor ha!
16:02:44 Watusimoto but... your mileage may vary!
16:03:16 raptor i remember as a teenager that i was constantly told the lie that you have to make something of yourself by high school or college, otherwise you've failed
16:03:20 Watusimoto just saying that I was skeptical but pleasanlly surprised by the whole thing
16:03:31 raptor oh how many people have fallen into that trap..
16:03:37 raptor hmm...  might be interesting
16:03:38 Watusimoto especially seeing my first real girlfriend
16:03:43 raptor oh boy
16:03:47 Watusimoto :-)
16:04:10 bobdaduck_ bitfighter isn't very good for meeting girls
16:04:35 Watusimoto that it is not
16:05:06 bobdaduck_ you should fix that
16:05:09 bobdaduck_ #1 priority
16:05:39 Watusimoto maybe rebrand it "Justin Beiber's Bitfigher Pony Party!!!"
16:05:47 raptor hahaha
16:05:54 bobdaduck_ rofl
16:05:55 raptor is he still around in the limelight?
16:06:09 bobdaduck_ Yeah
16:06:20 Watusimoto I think so... we might need to wait until his star has faded a little more to get his endorsement
16:06:20 bobdaduck_ He's turned into a jerk so the media can continue following him around
16:06:31 bobdaduck_ If he was the same it all would have stopped long ago
16:06:38 bobdaduck_ I think he's making dubstep songs now or something like that
16:06:55 raptor and that's why i respect teen stars for getting out of show business before it's too late
16:07:07 raptor (the few that do)
16:09:28 raptor and...  back to bitfighter!  Watusimoto, did you see my message about luajit?
16:09:47 Watusimoto where?  here or on google?
16:09:49 raptor here
16:09:54 Watusimoto yes
16:09:57 Watusimoto and I answered it!
16:10:05 raptor man, how did i not see that..
16:10:22 Watusimoto no worries... you were reliving a high school beating or something
16:10:33 raptor wait..  i don't see a response..
16:10:50 raptor [15:35] <raptor> so if we wanted to do luajit (without lua-vec), we'd have to provide lua replacements for the point object and methods (like dot, distSquared, etc.) AND replace our (very few) calls to luaL_pushVec, luaL_tovec, etc.
16:10:56 Watusimoto raptor: yes
16:11:07 Watusimoto 23:36
16:11:12 raptor ah i see
16:11:18 Watusimoto how could you miss that???
16:11:28 raptor umm..  i guess i thought it was for something else..
16:11:40 Watusimoto well... then... for the record: yes
16:11:50 raptor so now to the lua jit problems -
16:12:09 raptor they compile on all our platforms, but only with the very specific build system in place
16:12:37 raptor it would be a fair amount of work to get the building of it integrated for our needs..
16:12:54 raptor i did find someone who started a CMakeLists.txt for it, i can probably build off of that
16:13:29 raptor but i did start the lua-vec integration
16:13:36 raptor i think i'm about 1/3 done...
16:13:42 raptor but it's very different
16:14:10 Watusimoto so you are trying to mix luavec into luajit?
16:14:10 bobdaduck_ BWAHAHAHAHA
16:14:13 bobdaduck_ Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
16:14:18 raptor yes..  luajit-vec
16:14:26 raptor :)
16:14:26 Watusimoto that would be super fast!
16:14:34 Watusimoto (probably)
16:14:49 Watusimoto the downside is there is no maintainer for such a beast
16:14:57 raptor yeah..
16:15:19 raptor and the benchmarks for luajit vs lua-vec already show luajit is faster
16:15:29 Watusimoto I wonder if you could hand the patches over to the luajit guys to maintain?
16:15:30 raptor https://code.google.com/p/lua-vec/wiki/Benchmarks
16:15:37 Watusimoto I saw those
16:15:46 raptor i doubt the luajit guy would maintain it
16:16:00 Watusimoto in reality, for our purposes, luajit would probably be fine
16:16:24 raptor so
16:16:32 raptor i'm wondering if I should:
16:16:38 Watusimoto well... actualy... lua-vec is also fine :-0
16:16:53 raptor 1.  continue integrating lua-vec
16:17:07 raptor yes, but luajit is fast for *everything*
16:17:31 raptor 2.  try to just integrate luajit
16:17:37 raptor 3.  something else!
16:18:11 raptor 4.  release 019!
16:18:16 Watusimoto I would suggest 1 only if it is a) an interesting project and/or b) you want to publish it or get someone else to do so
16:18:32 Watusimoto it seems  a lot of work just for bitfighter
16:18:44 raptor it has been so far..
16:19:03 Watusimoto I would like it, but i can't say we really need it
16:19:07 raptor but i started it, and now its monumental to try to get me to turn away
16:19:23 Watusimoto but what is your end game?
16:19:37 Watusimoto integrate it into bf, and redo it again when we upgrade lua again?
16:19:43 raptor to spend my sleep-deprived time proving to myself i can still to complicated things..
16:19:48 raptor *do
16:20:04 raptor well, if we went to luajit, we always be at luajit
16:20:15 raptor couldn't really upgrade to 5.2 -
16:20:18 raptor although
16:20:29 Watusimoto isn;t luajit at 5.2?
16:20:35 raptor i think luajit might have some 5.2 features, like the bit operations
16:21:27 raptor but it's API 5.1 compatible
16:22:05 raptor maybe we should fix luaW
16:22:31 raptor upstream has made more changes since we've release 018a - some of which fixed a few bugs
16:23:17 Watusimoto I see
16:23:31 Watusimoto yes, we should fix luaW
16:25:02 Watusimoto I'm not sure luajit is worth it, but maybe it is; I am not at all sure we need the perofmance boost a luavecjit implementation would have, and am pretty sure it's not worth the work
16:25:20 Watusimoto we can still use luaw with luajit, right?
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16:29:03 raptor yes
16:29:12 raptor luaW just requires 5.1 API
16:29:19 bobdaduck So has watusimoto seen DnD?
16:29:28 Watusimoto no, he hasn't
16:29:49 bobdaduck SHOULD he?
16:30:01 raptor it may be good to show him so he can see why we've considered luajit
16:30:05 raptor *i've
16:30:28 bobdaduck Yes, one should see how bad it has gotten
16:30:30 bobdaduck hosting
16:30:44 Watusimoto ah, I see
16:31:20 Watusimoto I can take a quick look, but need to get to bed soon
16:48:08 Watusimoto I think fixing luaw woudl fix what I'm sure are tons of memory leaks
16:48:29 bobdaduck Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
16:48:40 raptor oh yeah, that level kept inflating to like 500MB in 15 min.
16:48:47 raptor on kaen's VPS
16:50:08 Watusimoto wow
16:51:09 Watusimoto alright... signing off
16:51:09 BFLogBot Commit: fcb3b2e1af2c | Author: watusimoto  | Message: Improve vertical alignment of key symbols 
16:51:32 Watusimoto good night... I'll try to be on from time to time this week
16:51:39 Watusimoto otherwise... until Sunday!
16:51:58 raptor night!
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19:02:51 kaen my girlfriend asked me to put linux on her laptop because her windows install was infested and she didn't have an installation CD
19:02:59 kaen so I chose opensuse
19:03:42 raptor sweet!
19:03:51 raptor i like opensuse
19:04:05 raptor but it may not be the best for everyone
19:04:13 kaen it's the most just-worky of the distros I've used
19:04:19 raptor oh really?
19:04:20 raptor cool
19:04:41 kaen yeah. maybe it's my specific brand of laptop (toshiba) which is notorious for incompatible hardware
19:04:43 raptor i wasn't sure - i've been with it for so long that i imagine I just know how to solve problems..
19:04:49 kaen bugged acpi entries in the bios, etc.
19:04:52 raptor haha
19:05:08 kaen it was kind of fascinating watching her use it for the first time. she seemed to have no problems
19:05:17 raptor yeah laptops are good for testing distros..
19:05:21 raptor oh good
19:05:27 kaen spent like ten minutes trying to find the screensaver config panel, though
19:05:27 raptor what DE did you use?
19:05:30 kaen KDE
19:05:36 kaen it was the "prettiest"
19:05:40 raptor haha
19:05:57 raptor i like KDE because it still lets you configure lots
19:06:07 kaen it always makes me laugh hearing non-technical users critique OSs
19:06:20 raptor haha, that's true...
19:06:32 kaen like, the fact that 99% of the software in it was written and maintained by volunteers means virtually nothing
19:06:36 raptor because I wouldn't even consider 'pretty' one of the important factors..
19:06:44 kaen but having to enter your password all the time is unacceptable.
19:06:46 kaen etc.
19:07:17 kaen the screensavers all got lack-luster reviews...
19:07:33 raptor haha
19:08:06 kaen and there was no mention of the obvious performance pickups (or the fact that she didn't have unsolicited popups).
19:08:17 kaen but the bouncy-ball widget was a massive hit.
19:08:35 raptor hahaha
19:08:51 kaen overall a positive review though.
19:09:06 raptor well, i like it because it's green
19:09:09 raptor instead of puke
19:09:10 kaen heh
19:09:18 raptor or whatever ubuntu is now..
19:09:31 kaen oh, that's right, she loved the mascot
19:09:53 kaen yeah, ubuntu is decidedly burnt-bodily-fluid
19:48:01 Nothing_Much what's with ubuntu?
19:48:14 Nothing_Much oh and hello again
20:43:47 Nothing_Much Quit (Changing host)
20:43:47 Nothing_Much has joined
22:27:07 kaen raptor, any idea why pointTest in http://pastie.org/8033199 would segfault after exactly 8 iterations?
22:27:23 kaen and additionally why removing the "local" keyword would give malloc corruptions?

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These logs were automatically created by BFLogBot on irc.freenode.net.

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07:23:16	koda	yo
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08:35:42	raptor	On breifly
08:35:46	raptor	it's a girl!
08:36:09	raptor	ok bye
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08:41:48	bobdaduck	!!!!
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09:24:06	bobdaduck	buildbot noooo
10:31:59	koda	hey kaen how's the cmake thing going?
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11:25:30	bobdaduck	!!!!
11:25:41	raptor	so tired...
11:26:11	bobdaduck	Is baby?
11:26:15	raptor	also, girl babies look exactly like babies.. I don't know why I thought it might be different
11:26:22	raptor	* like boy
11:26:35	raptor	(in general)
11:26:41	raptor	they still look like naked mole rats
11:27:02	bobdaduck	xD
11:27:10	bobdaduck	grats!
11:27:13	raptor	thanks!
11:29:28	bobdaduck	So now I need to fix something that I liked better broken
11:29:46	bobdaduck	Picking up loot bags yields more gold than the loot bag should have in it.
11:30:02	raptor	math error
11:30:15	raptor	oh hey, our evangelist is back..
11:35:22	kaen	indeed.
11:35:29	kaen	hello all, and congratulations raptor
11:35:32	raptor	hi
11:35:35	raptor	and thanks!
11:38:32	bobdaduck	Yeah I know its a math error
11:38:47	bobdaduck	But I kind of liked the mechanic but, as the party showed, its too abusable.
11:38:54	bobdaduck	Kaen did you get any crash logs that night at all?
11:39:56	kaen	nope.
11:40:43	kaen	the crashes were all because my host was killing the bitfighter process
11:41:00	kaen	because the ram kept climbing to over 600MB
11:41:25	kaen	and it put me over my allowed peak RAM usage :P
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11:47:10	raptor	ha
11:49:11	bobdaduck	xD
11:50:53	kaen	I was thinking, if the userdata you get for a single object between each occurrence of an event callback are not equal to each other, doesn't that mean that luaW is creating a new userdata for each one?
11:51:05	raptor	it is
11:51:09	raptor	that's the leak
11:51:09	kaen	ah
11:51:19	kaen	I never realized how it would scale...
11:51:39	raptor	we disabled the luaW clean up because it was cleaning up object that it shouldn't be and we'd get reandom script crashes
11:51:43	raptor	that was the 'fix'
11:52:07	bobdaduck	Wait what?
11:52:11	raptor	yeah, well - we didn't seem to think it would be that big of an issue..
11:52:35	raptor	then bobdaduck makes a level to break our assumptions..
11:52:49	kaen	a familiar feeling.
11:52:55	raptor	yes
11:53:02	bobdaduck	I'm nearly sorry!
11:57:58	raptor	so I have two major issues with luajit-vec
11:58:03	raptor	one it the -vec part
11:58:07	raptor	the other is the jit part
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12:00:56	bobdaduck	So what can I do to optimize dnd?
12:05:05	raptor	you might be stuck for now..
12:07:03	bobdaduck	cool
12:11:43	bobdaduck	could someone do a logic examination on this code?
12:11:46	bobdaduck	http://pastie.org/8031397
12:12:06	bobdaduck	people currently picking up way more gold than was originally dropped.
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14:08:06	bobdaduck	fixed!
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14:58:52	bobdaduck	Welcome back
14:58:54	bobdaduck	Congrats on the baby again
14:58:56	raptor	hi
14:58:59	raptor	thanks
14:59:29	raptor	i may be somewhat lower intelligence for the next few days because of sleep deprivation... but maybe you won't notice a thing :)
14:59:55	raptor	so forgive me if the obvious may not be so obvious to me at times
15:00:44	bobdaduck	lol
15:00:49	bobdaduck	Forgiven in advance
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15:16:30	Watusimoto	good evening
15:17:04	bobdaduck	Even'nin
15:18:56	Watusimoto	raptor, kaen, anyone else: Just to let you know I have a business meeting this week, so will only be on intermittently. I won't really be back until Sunday evening. I leave in the morning.
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15:31:18	raptor	hi Watusimoto
15:31:26	Watusimoto	hi
15:31:59	raptor	that's ok, we'll make sure DnD becomes a permanent part of the game..
15:32:04	Watusimoto	I was just looking back at the tests i wrote last night... very voluminous
15:32:10	Watusimoto	excellent!
15:32:21	raptor	the game is in good hands..
15:32:27	raptor	oh, i should check that..
15:32:29	Watusimoto	indeed it is
15:32:53	raptor	oh wow, lots of test
15:32:58	koda	hi all
15:33:02	raptor	hi koda
15:33:35	Watusimoto	if you are interested in the details of the timing of what happens when, it's all there... timed down to the ms
15:33:41	Watusimoto	hi koda\
15:34:11	bobdaduck_	DnD will soon have its own dedicated server
15:34:47	koda	raptor: i read your 'it's a girl' message so i think what it is
15:34:52	koda	raptor: congratulations \o/
15:35:06	raptor	so if we wanted to do luajit (without lua-vec), we'd have to provide lua replacements for the point object and methods (like dot, distSquared, etc.) AND replace our (very few) calls to luaL_pushVec, luaL_tovec, etc.
15:35:14	raptor	thanks koda!
15:35:25	Watusimoto	you had a girl?
15:35:29	raptor	yes
15:35:34	Watusimoto	congratulations!!!
15:35:48	raptor	my older coworkers curses came true..
15:35:52	raptor	thanks!
15:36:04	koda	what's her name?
15:36:10	Watusimoto	raptor: yes
15:36:11	raptor	Katherine
15:36:34	Watusimoto	Great name!
15:37:02	raptor	the wife chose it.. I honestly had no real idea what a good girl's name would be..
15:37:31	Watusimoto	I think girls names are easier than boys... that's what we found when looking for names
15:38:05	Watusimoto	I was arguing for Calvin, but my wife said we'd be doomed if we chose that name
15:38:11	raptor	hahaha
15:38:35	raptor	I've always wondered how much a name could shape a personality in a child..
15:38:58	Watusimoto	I'm sure it has some effect, but probably less than other factors
15:39:26	Watusimoto	I saw a study on tha trecently, actually
15:40:22	Watusimoto	there is also a section on names in the Freakanomics movie
15:40:53	Watusimoto	they researched response rates to identical resumes sent from "John" and "Tyrone"
15:40:58	Watusimoto	or somesuch
15:41:05	raptor	haha
15:41:14	Watusimoto	with predictable outcome
15:41:38	raptor	well, there's the obvious effect - like my last name ended up rhyming really well in high school...
15:42:03	Watusimoto	raptor must flaptor his wings!
15:42:08	raptor	haha
15:42:11	Watusimoto	craptor raptor
15:42:31	raptor	haha
15:42:31	Watusimoto	I will NOT be naming my thrid child "craptor"
15:43:03	Nothing_Much	Hello
15:43:43	raptor	hi
15:43:48	Nothing_Much	what's up?
15:44:13	Nothing_Much	oh my
15:44:15	raptor	actually, maybe everything rhymes with something..
15:44:23	Watusimoto	not true
15:44:30	Watusimoto	"orange"
15:44:35	raptor	in some way, in high school..
15:44:37	Nothing_Much	and purple
15:44:50	raptor	orange you going open the door?
15:45:26	raptor	orange you going to catch that frisbee??
15:45:52	Watusimoto	orange you ugly?
15:45:57	bobdaduck_	lol
15:46:05	raptor	haha
15:46:10	Watusimoto	c'mon... it's high school... open the door?
15:46:27	raptor	let's just say that maybe it was more my personality that got me picked on..
15:46:58	Watusimoto	high school can be a brutal time
15:47:09	raptor	that's why i left after junior year!
15:47:19	Watusimoto	off to work in the mills?
15:47:37	raptor	it had nothing left to offer
15:47:43	raptor	i went to college instead
15:47:53	raptor	and i'm still there!
15:47:55	raptor	sigh
15:48:00	Watusimoto	some of my friends did the same
15:48:06	Nothing_Much	you can go to college without finishing high school?
15:48:11	bobdaduck_	yeah
15:48:20	raptor	yep
15:48:25	Nothing_Much	interesting
15:48:30	bobdaduck_	Its harder to get into a good college (I think?) but colleges can do whatever they want
15:48:38	raptor	and i would highly recommend it to anyone who thinks high was as stupid as I did
15:48:49	raptor	*high school
15:48:54	Nothing_Much	finished high school, can't finish college atm :(
15:48:56	bobdaduck_	I enjoyed high school except for the school part
15:49:35	raptor	my problem was, though, that i loved the learning but i hated the social part - not because i was bad (I was) but because i saw it as a tremendous waste of time and energy (and it was)
15:49:55	bobdaduck_	I was the opposite
15:50:05	Watusimoto	I have to disagree with you there... some of my closest friends were my friends from high school
15:50:14	bobdaduck_	I hated the learning (I already knew everything) but I loved the social part
15:50:25	raptor	Watusimoto: high school in the west or east?
15:50:31	Watusimoto	Boston!
15:50:32	Nothing_Much	I have to say that high school was the only school I ever made friends with
15:50:58	Watusimoto	well, Arlington, but close enough
15:51:09	raptor	so i made closer, but fewer friends in the east, but lots more enemies
15:51:13	Nothing_Much	mostly because people wanted to see why I was so shy
15:51:22	Watusimoto	but then, I was pretty fortunate in the group of people who were there then
15:51:46	raptor	than in thw west, i mean
15:53:33	Watusimoto	a lot of it is luck, I think... you either have a good combination of personalities, or a bad one
15:54:11	raptor	well, i went to a lot of different schools in different towns on the east coast, growing up
15:54:21	raptor	either I had constant bad luck, or just the wrong personality
15:54:36	Watusimoto	it's harder being the new kid
15:54:39	raptor	probably being both
15:54:47	raptor	yeah that was a big part of it i'm sure
15:55:13	Watusimoto	i went to the same schools, with mostly the same people, from K-12
15:55:19	raptor	what!>?
15:55:28	raptor	i can't even fathom what that would be like..
15:55:46	Watusimoto	of my 4 best friends, I knew two of them from 3rd grade (well, one was my best friend in k)
15:55:53	Watusimoto	or maybe 1st grade
15:56:00	Watusimoto	two others I met in hs
15:56:05	raptor	wow
15:56:07	raptor	that's cool
15:56:11	raptor	and still friends?
15:56:14	Watusimoto	yes
15:56:36	Watusimoto	one lives just up the street from me in the us, though I don't see him all that often
15:58:14	Watusimoto	but my brother, in similar cicrumstances, had a nearly opposite outcome
15:58:21	raptor	:(
15:58:34	Watusimoto	which I attribute mostly to personalities
15:58:56	raptor	i'd like to think that i'm mostly over high school atrocities... except for raging against how stupid it was :)
15:58:56	Watusimoto	the combined assemblage of personalities, that is
15:59:14	Watusimoto	yeah, well... who wasn't?
16:00:20	Watusimoto	hs reunions can be very interesting
16:00:26	raptor	never been to one
16:00:33	Watusimoto	you should go!
16:00:35	raptor	too many highschools..
16:00:43	raptor	you think?
16:00:53	Watusimoto	I thought they would be totally lame... but it turned out that they were rather interesting
16:01:02	Watusimoto	it, not they
16:01:07	Watusimoto	only went to one
16:01:17	raptor	i would probably find them interesting in an intellictual-glad-i-didn't-make-those-choices sort of way
16:01:28	Watusimoto	that's part of it :-)
16:01:32	raptor	heh
16:01:44	Watusimoto	just interesting to see how people turned out... what did they do with themselves?
16:02:26	Watusimoto	kind of like reading the end of a book
16:02:32	raptor	ha!
16:02:44	Watusimoto	but... your mileage may vary!
16:03:16	raptor	i remember as a teenager that i was constantly told the lie that you have to make something of yourself by high school or college, otherwise you've failed
16:03:20	Watusimoto	just saying that I was skeptical but pleasanlly surprised by the whole thing
16:03:31	raptor	oh how many people have fallen into that trap..
16:03:37	raptor	hmm... might be interesting
16:03:38	Watusimoto	especially seeing my first real girlfriend
16:03:43	raptor	oh boy
16:03:47	Watusimoto	:-)
16:04:10	bobdaduck_	bitfighter isn't very good for meeting girls
16:04:35	Watusimoto	that it is not
16:05:06	bobdaduck_	you should fix that
16:05:09	bobdaduck_	#1 priority
16:05:39	Watusimoto	maybe rebrand it "Justin Beiber's Bitfigher Pony Party!!!"
16:05:47	raptor	hahaha
16:05:54	bobdaduck_	rofl
16:05:55	raptor	is he still around in the limelight?
16:06:09	bobdaduck_	Yeah
16:06:20	Watusimoto	I think so... we might need to wait until his star has faded a little more to get his endorsement
16:06:20	bobdaduck_	He's turned into a jerk so the media can continue following him around
16:06:31	bobdaduck_	If he was the same it all would have stopped long ago
16:06:38	bobdaduck_	I think he's making dubstep songs now or something like that
16:06:55	raptor	and that's why i respect teen stars for getting out of show business before it's too late
16:07:07	raptor	(the few that do)
16:09:28	raptor	and... back to bitfighter! Watusimoto, did you see my message about luajit?
16:09:47	Watusimoto	where? here or on google?
16:09:49	raptor	here
16:09:54	Watusimoto	yes
16:09:57	Watusimoto	and I answered it!
16:10:05	raptor	man, how did i not see that..
16:10:22	Watusimoto	no worries... you were reliving a high school beating or something
16:10:33	raptor	wait.. i don't see a response..
16:10:50	raptor	[15:35] <raptor> so if we wanted to do luajit (without lua-vec), we'd have to provide lua replacements for the point object and methods (like dot, distSquared, etc.) AND replace our (very few) calls to luaL_pushVec, luaL_tovec, etc.
16:10:56	Watusimoto	raptor: yes
16:11:07	Watusimoto	23:36
16:11:12	raptor	ah i see
16:11:18	Watusimoto	how could you miss that???
16:11:28	raptor	umm.. i guess i thought it was for something else..
16:11:40	Watusimoto	well... then... for the record: yes
16:11:50	raptor	so now to the lua jit problems -
16:12:09	raptor	they compile on all our platforms, but only with the very specific build system in place
16:12:37	raptor	it would be a fair amount of work to get the building of it integrated for our needs..
16:12:54	raptor	i did find someone who started a CMakeLists.txt for it, i can probably build off of that
16:13:29	raptor	but i did start the lua-vec integration
16:13:36	raptor	i think i'm about 1/3 done...
16:13:42	raptor	but it's very different
16:14:10	Watusimoto	so you are trying to mix luavec into luajit?
16:14:10	bobdaduck_	BWAHAHAHAHA
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16:14:18	raptor	yes.. luajit-vec
16:14:26	raptor	:)
16:14:26	Watusimoto	that would be super fast!
16:14:34	Watusimoto	(probably)
16:14:49	Watusimoto	the downside is there is no maintainer for such a beast
16:14:57	raptor	yeah..
16:15:19	raptor	and the benchmarks for luajit vs lua-vec already show luajit is faster
16:15:29	Watusimoto	I wonder if you could hand the patches over to the luajit guys to maintain?
16:15:30	raptor	https://code.google.com/p/lua-vec/wiki/Benchmarks
16:15:37	Watusimoto	I saw those
16:15:46	raptor	i doubt the luajit guy would maintain it
16:16:00	Watusimoto	in reality, for our purposes, luajit would probably be fine
16:16:24	raptor	so
16:16:32	raptor	i'm wondering if I should:
16:16:38	Watusimoto	well... actualy... lua-vec is also fine :-0
16:16:53	raptor	1. continue integrating lua-vec
16:17:07	raptor	yes, but luajit is fast for everything
16:17:31	raptor	2. try to just integrate luajit
16:17:37	raptor	3. something else!
16:18:11	raptor	4. release 019!
16:18:16	Watusimoto	I would suggest 1 only if it is a) an interesting project and/or b) you want to publish it or get someone else to do so
16:18:32	Watusimoto	it seems a lot of work just for bitfighter
16:18:44	raptor	it has been so far..
16:19:03	Watusimoto	I would like it, but i can't say we really need it
16:19:07	raptor	but i started it, and now its monumental to try to get me to turn away
16:19:23	Watusimoto	but what is your end game?
16:19:37	Watusimoto	integrate it into bf, and redo it again when we upgrade lua again?
16:19:43	raptor	to spend my sleep-deprived time proving to myself i can still to complicated things..
16:19:48	raptor	*do
16:20:04	raptor	well, if we went to luajit, we always be at luajit
16:20:15	raptor	couldn't really upgrade to 5.2 -
16:20:18	raptor	although
16:20:29	Watusimoto	isn;t luajit at 5.2?
16:20:35	raptor	i think luajit might have some 5.2 features, like the bit operations
16:21:27	raptor	but it's API 5.1 compatible
16:22:05	raptor	maybe we should fix luaW
16:22:31	raptor	upstream has made more changes since we've release 018a - some of which fixed a few bugs
16:23:17	Watusimoto	I see
16:23:31	Watusimoto	yes, we should fix luaW
16:25:02	Watusimoto	I'm not sure luajit is worth it, but maybe it is; I am not at all sure we need the perofmance boost a luavecjit implementation would have, and am pretty sure it's not worth the work
16:25:20	Watusimoto	we can still use luaw with luajit, right?
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16:29:03	raptor	yes
16:29:12	raptor	luaW just requires 5.1 API
16:29:19	bobdaduck	So has watusimoto seen DnD?
16:29:28	Watusimoto	no, he hasn't
16:29:49	bobdaduck	SHOULD he?
16:30:01	raptor	it may be good to show him so he can see why we've considered luajit
16:30:05	raptor	*i've
16:30:28	bobdaduck	Yes, one should see how bad it has gotten
16:30:30	bobdaduck	hosting
16:30:44	Watusimoto	ah, I see
16:31:20	Watusimoto	I can take a quick look, but need to get to bed soon
16:48:08	Watusimoto	I think fixing luaw woudl fix what I'm sure are tons of memory leaks
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16:48:40	raptor	oh yeah, that level kept inflating to like 500MB in 15 min.
16:48:47	raptor	on kaen's VPS
16:50:08	Watusimoto	wow
16:51:09	Watusimoto	alright... signing off
16:51:09		BFLogBot Commit: fcb3b2e1af2c \| Author: watusimoto \| Message: Improve vertical alignment of key symbols
16:51:32	Watusimoto	good night... I'll try to be on from time to time this week
16:51:39	Watusimoto	otherwise... until Sunday!
16:51:58	raptor	night!
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19:02:51	kaen	my girlfriend asked me to put linux on her laptop because her windows install was infested and she didn't have an installation CD
19:02:59	kaen	so I chose opensuse
19:03:42	raptor	sweet!
19:03:51	raptor	i like opensuse
19:04:05	raptor	but it may not be the best for everyone
19:04:13	kaen	it's the most just-worky of the distros I've used
19:04:19	raptor	oh really?
19:04:20	raptor	cool
19:04:41	kaen	yeah. maybe it's my specific brand of laptop (toshiba) which is notorious for incompatible hardware
19:04:43	raptor	i wasn't sure - i've been with it for so long that i imagine I just know how to solve problems..
19:04:49	kaen	bugged acpi entries in the bios, etc.
19:04:52	raptor	haha
19:05:08	kaen	it was kind of fascinating watching her use it for the first time. she seemed to have no problems
19:05:17	raptor	yeah laptops are good for testing distros..
19:05:21	raptor	oh good
19:05:27	kaen	spent like ten minutes trying to find the screensaver config panel, though
19:05:27	raptor	what DE did you use?
19:05:30	kaen	KDE
19:05:36	kaen	it was the "prettiest"
19:05:40	raptor	haha
19:05:57	raptor	i like KDE because it still lets you configure lots
19:06:07	kaen	it always makes me laugh hearing non-technical users critique OSs
19:06:20	raptor	haha, that's true...
19:06:32	kaen	like, the fact that 99% of the software in it was written and maintained by volunteers means virtually nothing
19:06:36	raptor	because I wouldn't even consider 'pretty' one of the important factors..
19:06:44	kaen	but having to enter your password all the time is unacceptable.
19:06:46	kaen	etc.
19:07:17	kaen	the screensavers all got lack-luster reviews...
19:07:33	raptor	haha
19:08:06	kaen	and there was no mention of the obvious performance pickups (or the fact that she didn't have unsolicited popups).
19:08:17	kaen	but the bouncy-ball widget was a massive hit.
19:08:35	raptor	hahaha
19:08:51	kaen	overall a positive review though.
19:09:06	raptor	well, i like it because it's green
19:09:09	raptor	instead of puke
19:09:10	kaen	heh
19:09:18	raptor	or whatever ubuntu is now..
19:09:31	kaen	oh, that's right, she loved the mascot
19:09:53	kaen	yeah, ubuntu is decidedly burnt-bodily-fluid
19:48:01	Nothing_Much	what's with ubuntu?
19:48:14	Nothing_Much	oh and hello again
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22:27:07	kaen	raptor, any idea why pointTest in http://pastie.org/8033199 would segfault after exactly 8 iterations?
22:27:23	kaen	and additionally why removing the "local" keyword would give malloc corruptions?