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| 00:32:36 | SolumnMushroom | Hello! |
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| 00:55:00 | fordcars | Hi! |
| 00:55:19 | SolumnMushroom | How's development going? |
| 00:56:29 | fordcars | I guess it's going good :D |
| 01:00:08 | SolumnMushroom | I'm introducing one of my friends to the game |
| 01:00:18 | fordcars | Sweet! |
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| 03:49:39 | Nothing_Much | Oi.. what'd I miss? |
| 03:53:06 | Nothing_Much | Okay so it's in the source tree. |
| 03:53:10 | Nothing_Much | That's not good enough |
| 03:53:21 | Nothing_Much | The notification should be installed through the .deb's and .rpm's |
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| 04:13:15 | Nothing_Much | kaen: If you guys are seriously considering Steam, check out #steamlug, they're unofficial but they could help out a bit. |
| 04:13:24 | Nothing_Much | As to how Steam works |
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| 17:04:18 | raptor | good day! |
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| 17:40:00 | bobdaduck | I'm running low on pistachios... |
| 17:40:09 | raptor | MORE SALT |
| 17:56:56 | bobdaduck | The best of all the foods |
| 17:57:02 | bobdaduck | except for some of them |
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| 18:22:08 | raptor | I feel like my kids are load-balancing ear infections and fevers |
| 18:22:16 | Nothing_Much | Hey Watusimoto, are you guys strongly considering Steam now? |
| 18:28:16 | Nothing_Much | If so, I would recommend reading these links: http://steamcommunity.com/workshop/about/?appid=765§ion=faq#steamworks and http://www.steampowered.com/steamworks/FAQ.php |
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| 18:31:30 | Nothing_Much | well then |
| 18:46:47 | raptor | it was probably a kid of his using a computer at home |
| 18:50:28 | Nothing_Much | oh |
| 18:50:39 | Nothing_Much | oh by the way, raptor, was there a notifier for Linux somewhere? |
| 18:51:02 | raptor | yes |
| 18:51:11 | raptor | it is in the DATADIR directory (I think) |
| 18:51:24 | raptor | actually wait |
| 18:51:38 | raptor | it may be accessible directly on the command line: bitfighter_notifier.py |
| 18:52:28 | raptor | ha! ok, it works... but it's missing the icon |
| 18:52:31 | raptor | that's a bug |
| 18:53:30 | Nothing_Much | oh my |
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| 18:53:47 | Nothing_Much | lemme see if that works here |
| 18:53:51 | Watusimoto | hi |
| 18:53:57 | Nothing_Much | oh hey Watusimoto |
| 18:55:04 | Nothing_Much | raptor: in the source or in a directory from a .deb? |
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| 19:00:08 | Watusimoto | Nothing_Much: I don't think we've reached a conclusion about steam |
| 19:01:42 | Nothing_Much | I'd have to say I'm still somewhat mixed about it |
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| 19:03:12 | Nothing_Much | However my lack of knowledge to understanding how the Steamworks API and how Steam actually runs games is what's keeping me at bay. |
| 19:04:29 | Nothing_Much | 50/50% basically, but I'd be all for it if I knew what all that stuff meant in those links |
| 19:07:57 | raptor | Nothing_Much: which deb did you install? |
| 19:08:20 | Nothing_Much | Debian 7 |
| 19:08:25 | Nothing_Much | for Ubuntu 14.04 |
| 19:08:34 | raptor | 14.04 is out? |
| 19:09:24 | Nothing_Much | not yet :D |
| 19:09:33 | raptor | Nothing_Much: i think it's at: /usr/games/bitfighter_notifier.py |
| 19:09:36 | Nothing_Much | it's nightly releases :) |
| 19:09:39 | raptor | i think... |
| 19:09:43 | Nothing_Much | alright lemme see |
| 19:10:48 | Nothing_Much | well looks like there's no icon |
| 19:10:50 | Nothing_Much | but it's there |
| 19:10:53 | raptor | hooray! |
| 19:10:59 | raptor | uh.. for the 'there' part |
| 19:11:14 | Nothing_Much | it has an exit thing but that's it |
| 19:11:23 | Nothing_Much | but imo it should be somewhere where- |
| 19:11:25 | Nothing_Much | OMG IT WORKS |
| 19:11:29 | raptor | :) |
| 19:11:31 | Nothing_Much | notifier works nicely |
| 19:11:54 | Nothing_Much | but it should be in a folder where it can be started at startup and can be easily installed |
| 19:11:56 | Nothing_Much | erm |
| 19:12:02 | Nothing_Much | well installed then start at boot |
| 19:12:24 | raptor | well, the start-at-boot thing is actually bad practice in Linux |
| 19:12:40 | raptor | convention is to leave it to the user to start it when wanted |
| 19:12:54 | raptor | but make it easy to do so - which we don't necessarily do |
| 19:12:55 | Nothing_Much | oh really? |
| 19:12:58 | raptor | yes |
| 19:13:02 | Nothing_Much | well darn |
| 19:13:13 | Nothing_Much | but on Windows and OS X it starts when installed right? |
| 19:13:15 | raptor | because there are 1000s of Linux users and 10000s of Linux distros :) |
| 19:13:20 | raptor | yes |
| 19:13:26 | raptor | butt hey also have 'standards' |
| 19:13:27 | Nothing_Much | hmm.. |
| 19:13:38 | raptor | in fact |
| 19:13:55 | raptor | for the Linux notifier we have 3 different GUIs and 3 different messaging systems |
| 19:14:11 | raptor | it's just semi-smart at choosing the right one |
| 19:14:33 | Nothing_Much | right |
| 19:14:37 | Nothing_Much | well |
| 19:15:09 | Nothing_Much | Maybe there should be a sort of notifier tutorial in the game or maybe put the script in an easier to find folder |
| 19:15:43 | raptor | yes, that is probably a good idea |
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| 19:43:41 | kaen | Nothing_Much: last I heard, Steam doesn't require you to use Steamworks |
| 19:44:49 | kaen | obviously it's something we'd want to do, but it's not a barrier to entry. |
| 19:59:55 | raptor | back later! |
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| 20:27:38 | koda | hallo |
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| 21:03:23 | fordcars | Anybody know how to make a new Wiki page? |
| 21:03:56 | Nothing_Much | fordcars: It's been a while, but nope |
| 21:04:04 | fordcars | Ok :P |
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| 21:05:06 | Watusimoto | hi |
| 21:05:49 | fordcars | Oh I got it |
| 21:08:52 | Watusimoto | I had an idea, which I put on our buglist a while back, which was to measure teh size of each level so you could choose small or large level, depending on player count |
| 21:09:09 | Watusimoto | and we could present the choose level menu organized by level size |
| 21:09:29 | fordcars | Ahh maybe |
| 21:09:36 | Watusimoto | so the idea was when you start hosting, you'd measure each level's size and send that out with the rest of the level info |
| 21:10:19 | Watusimoto | the only problem is that that would require building bot zones (that's the only way I can think of to measure area), which is an expensive process to do on, say, 50 levels when you start hosting |
| 21:10:42 | Watusimoto | so my thought was that after you've measured a level's size, you'd save that in a database for future reference |
| 21:10:50 | Watusimoto | keyed off the levels md5 hash |
| 21:11:18 | Watusimoto | so when you were hosting, you'd hash each level, check the database, and only build zones for levels you hadn't seen before |
| 21:11:30 | Watusimoto | for ones you had seen before, you'd already know the size |
| 21:12:09 | Watusimoto | then I thought if we're doing all that, why not cache the level name and other details we usually grab from the level when we start hosting |
| 21:12:39 | Watusimoto | so 1) does this make sense; and 2) is level size actually interesting? |
| 21:13:14 | Watusimoto | and 3) shoudl the database be sqlite or just a flatfile we keep in memory for the duration of your bitfighter session? |
| 21:13:25 | fordcars | Watusimoto, can't you just get the maximum coords? |
| 21:13:50 | Watusimoto | maybe, but what if you had a leel with two tiny rooms connected with a distant teleporter |
| 21:13:56 | fordcars | Of Barriers and Items? |
| 21:14:02 | fordcars | Oh kokokok |
| 21:14:15 | fordcars | Yeah, bot zones |
| 21:14:40 | Watusimoto | but a big level with lots of long narrow corridors may be "larger" than one of equal area that is just a single room |
| 21:14:47 | Watusimoto | so even my measure is imperfect |
| 21:14:58 | fordcars | Hmm |
| 21:15:21 | Watusimoto | but we could refine the algo if need be in future versions |
| 21:16:04 | fordcars | Yeah |
| 21:16:08 | Watusimoto | anyway, i did some tests last night, and the cost of hashing each level as we load during the pre-game init is between 0 and 1 ms per level |
| 21:16:17 | Watusimoto | so not too much |
| 21:20:05 | fordcars | Oh that doesn't seem to bad :P |
| 21:21:25 | Watusimoto | and might get closer to 0 if we didn't read the file twice |
| 21:21:37 | Watusimoto | (once for analysis, once for md5) |
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| 21:45:42 | fordcars | Later! |
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| 21:46:15 | Skybax | Hey raptor |
| 21:47:09 | Skybax | Can you come test something for me? x) |
| 21:48:10 | raptor | i am beseiged! |
| 21:48:10 | Skybax | I've got a server up |
| 21:48:28 | raptor | ok |
| 21:59:58 | Watusimoto | anyone have any objections to adding a regex lib to our source? |
| 22:00:29 | raptor | WAIT |
| 22:01:02 | raptor | ok |
| 22:01:06 | raptor | so, first of all |
| 22:01:08 | kaen | isn't there one in boost? |
| 22:01:13 | Watusimoto | there is |
| 22:01:27 | Watusimoto | I'm looking at re2, which is supposed to be faster |
| 22:01:40 | Watusimoto | re2 is a google lib |
| 22:01:50 | raptor | Watusimoto: i noticed that you're doing refactoring stuff in the 'fixes-019' branch still |
| 22:02:09 | raptor | what is your plan with the 019 branch? |
| 22:02:16 | kaen | I have no strong opinion. |
| 22:02:19 | Watusimoto | ah |
| 22:02:23 | Watusimoto | do a release! |
| 22:02:36 | Watusimoto | everything checked in is releasable |
| 22:03:34 | kaen | what are we regexing? |
| 22:03:36 | raptor | so I was planning on doing 019b release over the weekend, but then sickness hit my family |
| 22:03:41 | kaen | it'd be nice to rewrite processArguments :P |
| 22:03:58 | raptor | and now we have 'broken' CMakeLists for dedicated server |
| 22:04:05 | raptor | should I try to fix that first? |
| 22:04:23 | Watusimoto | probably, though the centos instructions are up-to-date and will work |
| 22:04:43 | raptor | and then, I noticed you tagged some issues with 019c... do we want to continue on 019? |
| 22:04:50 | Watusimoto | I don't know |
| 22:04:55 | Watusimoto | I did that to defer a decision |
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| 22:05:04 | raptor | heh |
| 22:05:11 | Watusimoto | sorry your family is sick |
| 22:05:36 | raptor | yeah, it's why i wasn't around yesterday |
| 22:05:49 | Watusimoto | I want the regex to simplify getLevelInfoFromCodeChunk, and probably later to do a cleaner level parser |
| 22:05:51 | raptor | we've never really gotten sickness before - and now this year we've got them all |
| 22:05:57 | Watusimoto | it happens |
| 22:06:05 | Watusimoto | it sucks for a year or two, then it gets better again |
| 22:06:46 | Watusimoto | kids are walking biowarfare experiments |
| 22:07:29 | raptor | totally |
| 22:07:48 | raptor | ok, so |
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| 22:08:06 | raptor | back to regex - i'm not against it if we can statically compile on all platforms |
| 22:08:13 | raptor | and it's done on the 020 branch... |
| 22:08:13 | Watusimoto | that's the goal |
| 22:08:42 | raptor | ok, did you mean for the md5 stuff to go in 019? |
| 22:08:53 | Watusimoto | the source hasn;t changed in years; I was just going to incorporate it into the codebase |
| 22:09:11 | Watusimoto | the md5 stuff coudl go anywhere |
| 22:09:18 | Watusimoto | it changes no functionality |
| 22:09:24 | Watusimoto | (that I know of :-) |
| 22:09:46 | raptor | ok, let me verify I can compile... |
| 22:09:53 | Watusimoto | and was basically a change of calling convention from methods on a static object to methods in a namespace |
| 22:10:09 | Watusimoto | and that let us get rid of some weird cross-class dependencies |
| 22:10:24 | raptor | how about this: |
| 22:10:33 | raptor | do you have commits pending? |
| 22:10:46 | Watusimoto | yes, but nothing that can't wait |
| 22:11:24 | Watusimoto | whietspace and removal of a magic number |
| 22:11:47 | Watusimoto | and this messy refactor I am now in the middle of, which should not be part of the release |
| 22:12:09 | Watusimoto | we could even do the release pre-md5 if you are at all uneasy |
| 22:12:29 | Watusimoto | in fact, I thought that might be what we would do when I was checking in |
| 22:12:37 | raptor | well, you actually created another server side head |
| 22:12:43 | Watusimoto | good grief |
| 22:12:50 | raptor | so i was thinking of just letting you commit and work off of that |
| 22:13:08 | raptor | then when you go to bed, i'll merge it into 020, then work off the fixes-019 head |
| 22:13:13 | Watusimoto | we can release on your tip |
| 22:13:47 | Watusimoto | nothing I've done since matters -- it's all refactor; no bug fixes or anything |
| 22:13:57 | raptor | ok |
| 22:14:01 | raptor | soudns fine to me |
| 22:15:02 | Watusimoto | I'm working with a guy at work where every new feature, even tiny ones, is a new branch |
| 22:15:09 | Watusimoto | you'd love it |
| 22:15:27 | raptor | ha |
| 22:16:02 | raptor | i hope it's not SVN - some guys here at work do that with SVN.... that drives me bonkers |
| 22:16:10 | Watusimoto | no, git |
| 22:16:25 | Watusimoto | ok, so your tip will be the 019b release tip, and we'll merge everything together post release and... next release would be 020? |
| 22:17:08 | Watusimoto | though I don't think any compatibility issues have emerged |
| 22:17:19 | raptor | sure |
| 22:17:34 | Watusimoto | I guess we'll see what we end up doing |
| 22:17:35 | raptor | i guess, i was figuring a full new release because LuaJIT is quite a change... |
| 22:17:51 | Watusimoto | it is, but if it is still compatible.... |
| 22:17:53 | raptor | even though network compat isn't broken yet... |
| 22:18:00 | Watusimoto | we'll find a way to break it |
| 22:18:17 | raptor | i know you have some _019 methods lying around somewhere... |
| 22:18:19 | raptor | I think |
| 22:18:35 | Watusimoto | ok, so for the release, do you want to do the building again? |
| 22:18:44 | raptor | sure |
| 22:19:01 | Watusimoto | and I'll do the "softer" stuff; notifying where we want to notify and such |
| 22:19:03 | raptor | I think other than that CMake bit, there are no other bugs reported yet |
| 22:19:29 | Watusimoto | honestly, the cmake stuff doesn't really bother me |
| 22:19:41 | Watusimoto | if you fix it, we'll have to rewrite the centos instructions again |
| 22:19:45 | raptor | ok |
| 22:19:53 | raptor | well, OSX is horribly broke with LuaJIT |
| 22:20:01 | raptor | building OSX, that is |
| 22:20:04 | Watusimoto | yuck |
| 22:23:29 | raptor | ok last call for bug fixes! bobdaduck, Skybax_, Nothing_Much? |
| 22:23:35 | Watusimoto | do we still have a bf etherpad? |
| 22:23:45 | bobdaduck | etherpad like died |
| 22:23:48 | raptor | i've been using board.net |
| 22:24:05 | raptor | i installed etherpad on bitfighter.org once... but it used too much RAM |
| 22:24:15 | bobdaduck | I won't know about any of the bugs until after the party tomorrow, really. |
| 22:24:16 | Watusimoto | cool |
| 22:24:33 | raptor | oh, that's good! |
| 22:24:40 | Skybax_ | If you do /idle while in-game, thebackground stays there, but if you're still in /idle when the next level starts, the background stays black.. I don't really know if that's a bug or not |
| 22:25:07 | raptor | Skybax_: you mean right when the level loads? |
| 22:25:14 | raptor | you type in /idle? |
| 22:25:39 | Skybax_ | No, like, if you're in /idle when the game ends and it loads the next level, the background will stay black |
| 22:25:48 | Skybax_ | It won't show you the level until you come out of /idle |
| 22:25:56 | raptor | ahh |
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| 22:25:58 | raptor | ok |
| 22:26:09 | raptor | Watusimoto: do you think that is a bug? seems like normal behav |
| 22:26:14 | raptor | oir to me. |
| 22:26:16 | raptor | 0 |
| 22:26:18 | raptor | 66666666666666666666666663 |
| 22:26:49 | Watusimoto | I'd call that an undesireable quirk |
| 22:27:07 | Watusimoto | for our purposes, at this moment, it is not a bug |
| 22:27:24 | raptor | agreed |
| 22:27:31 | Watusimoto | Skybax: you can report it as a bug if you like |
| 22:27:42 | raptor | should I wait for bobdaduck's party tomorrow to see if there are more bugs? |
| 22:27:47 | raptor | :) |
| 22:28:05 | raptor | seems like a good time to get testing metrics.. |
| 22:28:42 | bobdaduck | Yeah dunno |
| 22:28:47 | bobdaduck | Do what you want |
| 22:31:55 | raptor | my 2 year-old spilled 2-3 oz of lavendar oil upstairs |
| 22:37:46 | | Flynnn has joined |
| 22:41:09 | bobdaduck | Yay! |
| 22:43:10 | raptor | Watusimoto: I just read the logs about level size - what about adding up the botzone area, ignoring external zones? |
| 22:43:40 | Watusimoto | yes |
| 22:43:43 | Watusimoto | exactly |
| 22:43:45 | raptor | actually, that has problems, too |
| 22:43:50 | Watusimoto | probably |
| 22:44:05 | Watusimoto | <sniff> do I smell flowers? |
| 22:44:24 | raptor | needless to say, we're a bit drowsy... |
| 22:45:56 | raptor | also, we did have a botzone cache at one point, that I think sam686 even wrote to disk in some raw format that would be read in.. |
| 22:50:13 | Watusimoto | http://board.net/p/bf019b |
| 22:50:38 | Watusimoto | we don't need the botzones; we just need the area |
| 22:51:08 | Watusimoto | that document was incredibly painful to create, btw |
| 22:53:24 | raptor | ha |
| 22:53:24 | raptor | how so? (unless textual sarcasm is lost on me, like normal..)) |
| 22:58:14 | Watusimoto | no it was |
| 22:58:58 | Watusimoto | I had to view source, save it as an html document, import it into open office html editor, select all, copy, paste into text editor, do some regex work on it, then copy to etherpad |
| 23:02:30 | raptor | sounds like too much work for that... |
| 23:04:59 | raptor | oh interesting - it doesn't let you select the numbers in mediawiki |
| 23:12:12 | Watusimoto | I can select them all except 1. |
| 23:12:19 | Watusimoto | but they don't paste |
| 23:12:27 | raptor | yeah, that's what I mean |
| 23:12:49 | raptor | so for 019b, you're editor plugin additions will be there, that OK? |
| 23:15:19 | | bobdaduck Quit (Remote host closed the connection) |
| 23:23:29 | raptor | *your |
| 23:26:23 | raptor | actually, I think you already approved that |
| 23:29:50 | raptor | 20.042. |
| 23:30:04 | raptor | 633333333333333333333+6 |
| 23:30:10 | raptor | .2+*96+ |
| 23:30:19 | raptor | 22222222222222222223000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000003 |
| 23:30:22 | raptor | 0...... |
| 23:30:45 | raptor | 10---------+-- |
| 23:31:58 | Nothing_Much | lol |
| 23:46:31 | Watusimoto | raptor: the plugins are fine |
| 23:58:26 | | Platskies has joined |