Level Database Tags [Split: sky_lark's Greatest Hits list]

[watusimoto]

@sky_lark,

In 019 (or in the current development build), you can upload your levels into a central level database (called pleiades), where people will be able to download them and rate them. I encourage you to upload your levels!

Oooh, looking forward to it!

I'm sure you guys have thought about all this, but will there be a way to add custom tags to differentiate levels? Tags like "small," "medium," "large," "bottlenecked," "open," etc.

[watusimoto]

I don't know the direct answer, but on the pleiades site (http://bitfighter.org/pleiades), there is a tagging capability. I'm not sure how those tags get added.

[kaen]

The tags are currently added only by admins, this might get opened up later.

The cat's out of the bag now.

Oh now that's just spiffy.

Looks like the tags will work great.

The tags are currently added only by admins, this might get opened up later.

The cat's out of the bag now.

Change your name and RUN!

[watusimoto]

Ideally, we could add tags via the game, but I can also see all sorts of problems with allowing folks free access to tags.

[watusimoto]

Hey, maybe we could add tags via a Tags line in the levelfile. Then it could be edited via the editor, and would be under the control of the level owner.

[bobdaduck]

That would make for a bit too much control on the levelmakers part. We'd have to be case unsensitive and stuff...

Name: Levelgen carnival
Tags: Carnival, Fun, awesome, cool, delicious, levelgen, hiraptor, disneyland

[raptor]

Some other examples:

bobdaduckvsteamturret, watusimotoisthegreatestplayerever, tagsaresorandomanyways

[Skybax]

And then Bitfighter becomes InstaGram.

[Little_Apple]

bobdaduck, if we could get a bip taking a selfie that'd be greeeaaaat...

I don't see the problem with too many tags. You don't have to show all of them in the display menu. Tags are just useful for finding similar maps. They can remain invisible, appearing only when specifically searched for.

That being said, there is obviously an issue if tags are mislabeled. Then if someone searches for a map with a specific feature in mind and gets a whole bunch of maps that aren't at all related, search becomes pointless.

Fortunately, with a community as small as ours I'd expect - well, hope - people to be reasonable with tags and apply them only as necessary. If not, well, a report tag function should be straightforward; or just allow any registered user to modify tags (thereby letting the community watch for inappropriate tags).

My issue with not allowing free use of tags was that I was worried the "curator" wouldn't be able to think up all of the various useful tags. That has a fairly simple fix, just let folks suggest new tags as they come up, but then you run into the trouble of having to retag maps as new tags are added. There's no real winnable solution here (at least, that I can think of) except to try to ensure we cover all of the bases the first time.

PS. Can a kind mod split these topics?

[kaen]

I don't want to stay with the admin-only tag system for very long, but at least for getting started that's how I want to handle things. Our community is pretty small, and you can almost always reach a forum admin/moderator within an hour or less and I expect that the amount of new tags that are legitimately needed will start small and shrink smaller. At most I'd say it would take a day for a new tag to be added in the worst case.

Later on, I'd like to move to the system used on Stack Overflow, which requires a user to have 1500 reputation before adding a tag (which is between 150 and 300 upvotes, depending on how the user gets them). Problem is that we don't have, and perhaps do not want, per-user reputation.

The reason I really, really do not want to open up free range on tags is because if there ever is a mess, it could be very hard to clean up. Not only that, but even if everyone tries their best be thoughtful and responsible, some overlap and redundancy is inevitable. I want tags to be unique, idempotent, meaningful, and unambiguous. That's a pretty tough set of criteria, so letting anyone create any tag they want is a sure-shot way to mess it up.

TL;DR: I plan to open it up a bit more in the future, but for now I plan on keeping them moderator-only until I work out a better system.

Makes sense. For what it's worth, I completely agree with your fundamental goal of tags - hopefully, I'm exaggerating the number of tags needed to make for a good level database. And even then a simple suggestions thread should be sufficient for funneling tag suggestions down the pipeline.

Another issue at play here is the application of tags to a map. Do you think only the uploader should be able to choose what tags his/her maps receive, or should "everybody" (registered forum users, more likely) be able to tag? Or something in the middle? Benefit of more users tagging is to cover every aspect of a map, and to ensure accuracy in the tags.

I'm not so worried about trolls spamming the system as I am about honest mislabeling (or, not enough labeling), but I suppose there ought to be measures in place to prevent that too.

[watusimoto]

I support what kaen said.

I don't want to stay with the admin-only tag system for very long, but at least for getting started that's how I want to handle things. Our community is pretty small, and you can almost always reach a forum admin/moderator within an hour or less and I expect that the amount of new tags that are legitimately needed will start small and shrink smaller. At most I'd say it would take a day for a new tag to be added in the worst case.

Later on, I'd like to move to the system used on Stack Overflow, which requires a user to have 1500 reputation before adding a tag (which is between 150 and 300 upvotes, depending on how the user gets them). Problem is that we don't have, and perhaps do not want, per-user reputation.

The reason I really, really do not want to open up free range on tags is because if there ever is a mess, it could be very hard to clean up. Not only that, but even if everyone tries their best be thoughtful and responsible, some overlap and redundancy is inevitable. I want tags to be unique, idempotent, meaningful, and unambiguous. That's a pretty tough set of criteria, so letting anyone create any tag they want is a sure-shot way to mess it up.

TL;DR: I plan to open it up a bit more in the future, but for now I plan on keeping them moderator-only until I work out a better system.

There should be categories then. Big, small, bobdaduck style...

Yeah i could see poeple loading a crash maps alot......

[watusimoto]

bobdaduck style

If it walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck...