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sky_lark

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Post Fri May 15, 2020 10:54 pm

Scoreboard thoughts

Hey, I don't know how much active development there is on bitfighter currently, or if new changes are even being considered. But could the text on the scoreboard potentially be shrunk a bit? Or have the badges be hidden behind the threat level? The badges overlap with the threat level, making it tough to read. :)

Screen Shot 2020-05-14 at 10.29.10 PM.png
(If you can't see the image: https://i.imgur.com/ZbNUzLW.png)

Speaking of threat level, I figure it's some cumulative stat that combines other various stats to produce a result or something? I couldn't find any info in the wiki, forum or in-game help.

To be honest, while it's certainly intriguing, I have no baseline for what a "good" or "bad" threat level is. I'm guessing negative is bad, but outside of that, I don't know if 0.17 is considered great or just middling, or if -0.42 is considered hot garbage or just mediocre. I also am not sure how threatening a decimal score really feels... Is there any consideration with replacing threat level with traditional kills/deaths/scores?

Finally, there doesn't seem to be any clear ordering of player names on the scoreboard. I had figured players would be ordered by threat level but that doesn't seem to be the case. Nor does it seem to be ordered by name, player level, or ping. Is there something else ordering it behind the scenes, or perhaps this is a bug?

Thanks for your consideration!
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Fordcars

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Post Sat May 16, 2020 4:17 pm

Re: Scoreboard thoughts

sky_lark wrote:Is there any consideration with replacing threat level with traditional kills/deaths/scores?


That would maybe make an interesting thing to check out at the end of games. Maybe the game could highlight (MVP?) the player with the craziest k/d ratio at the end of the game?
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amgine

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Post Sat May 16, 2020 6:14 pm

Re: Scoreboard thoughts

Yeah I think The score boards need a tune up.

One I idea I ahd is show the top maybe 1-5 players then show your score underneath

KDA would be really good to but might make the board hard to read withour a rework.

as for scoreboard I belive its related to the order people joined the lobby
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sky_lark

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Post Sat May 16, 2020 11:05 pm

Re: Scoreboard thoughts

If the text was shrunk down I would think there could certainly be four columns for kills, deaths, scores, and ping. Don't get me wrong, threat level is cool, I just have a tough time translating it into something that I can relate to. Like if my team has:

Quartz 0.07
bobdaduck –0.13
footloose 0.22
raptor 0.35
sky_lark –0.05

At first glance I don't know what these numbers mean, nor do I have a reference for what is considered great, good, average, bad, poor, etc. If I'm at -0.05 and quartz is at 0.07 and raptor is at 0.35, I can assume raptor is doing better than quartz, but... by how much? By what metric? It's just tricky to get a sense for how we are performing as a team or how the other team is performing.

as for scoreboard I belive its related to the order people joined the lobby

If this is true, it would be great if this could be changed to sort by threat level (or scores/kills, if that gets modified). One of the main reasons I check the scoreboard in modes like bitmatch and nexus (where the scoreboard IS ordered by kill/score) is to see how players are performing relative to each other. It's not terribly helpful to see which player joined the server the earliest.
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sky_lark

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Post Sat May 16, 2020 11:38 pm

Re: Scoreboard thoughts

It looks like the scoreboard badge overlapping issue is in the github issues list here and here already. Some interesting ideas within, but honestly, I think just shrinking the size of all the text would solve 99% of these instances. At least for the time being :)
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bobdaduck

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Post Mon May 18, 2020 11:38 am

Re: Scoreboard thoughts

Threat level being reset each game would be an improvement I think, if it doesn't already
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raptor

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Post Mon May 18, 2020 4:17 pm

Re: Scoreboard thoughts

bobdaduck wrote:Threat level being reset each game would be an improvement I think, if it doesn't already

The threat level (which is K/D ratio spread over -1 to 1 bytheway) was intended to be for the duration of being connected to server and to more-or-less aid in balancing teams.
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bobdaduck

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Post Mon May 18, 2020 4:23 pm

Re: Scoreboard thoughts

Sure but that's not as useful for players, players want to see how good they're doing :P
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raptor

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Post Mon May 18, 2020 5:36 pm

Re: Scoreboard thoughts

OK, I can see replacing that metric with K/D on a per-round basis would be better in that sense.
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Santiago ZAP

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Post Tue May 19, 2020 9:56 am

Re: Scoreboard thoughts

What about player score, possible along of of KD Ratio? We only have that in FFA Gamemodes, what about having "flags captured", and alike in the rest?

Also, what if every section had a limit to how much it can display in an area, say, if you have too many badges, or if you have a long ass name *coughmecough*, it gets "masked", bonus if it can scroll in that area to display the full name/badges

Like so (Horrible edit btw) Image
https://imgur.com/a/bdvCYtt
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amgine

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Post Wed May 20, 2020 8:18 am

Re: Scoreboard thoughts

It should be easy to do I would imagine
in python ( a similar code im learning) you can check the string length with

len()

you could also just delete extra stuff with something like

if len() > x
print string [:x]

note that I did this in like 50 seconds so its completly wrongly written but the idea is it checks the string lengh and its to long it cuts of anything beyond a certain point :p
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sky_lark

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Post Sat May 23, 2020 1:22 am

Re: Scoreboard thoughts

Thanks for the information about the threat level! That's interesting to know. I'm a bit surprised that it isn't resetting per round. Wouldn't this mean that the threat level could be negatively skewed when playing death-intensive maps like dungeons and novelty maps?

@Santiago, that's a solid idea. I do still think resizing the text on the leaderboard would be sufficient for 99% of use cases and still be plenty easy to read. Of course, if more badges get added then maybe a different solution would need to be explored.

@raptor or whomever, personally I am a fan of adding Scores/Kills/Deaths to the leaderboard, but even if it's not added, could the player names at least be sorted by threat level on team maps? This would at least make it easy to see which players were doing well, where we stood relatively for our own interest, and who... ahem... wasn't quite pulling their weight. ;)
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amgine

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Post Sat May 23, 2020 6:36 pm

Re: Scoreboard thoughts

Slighly related but what if instead there was a different score board based on the game mode

Bitmatch would be KDA ratios.

Soccer would be goals

Rabbit would be run time and rabbit kills

ctf would be captures and KDA

ect.

it would take quite a bit of work but once the initial scoreboards formats are made you should just need to call varaibles and plug in values.
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sky_lark

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Post Wed May 27, 2020 6:28 pm

Re: Scoreboard thoughts

I think just having three columns for scores, kills, deaths, and then a fourth for ping, would be sufficient. No need to change based on the game mode. It's clear and consistent and conveys the important information for all of the game types. Text might need to be shrunk a bit but imo it should be shrunk anyway to solve the badge display issue.
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amgine

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Post Mon Jun 01, 2020 8:01 am

Re: Scoreboard thoughts

Ok but doing the same things isnt usefull in every game mode.

for example KDA ratios in soccer doesnt mean anything to how much you contributed to a win.

or for capture the flag its not as relevant as the nubmer of times you grabbed scored and recovered a flag.
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Skybax

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Post Mon Jun 01, 2020 10:31 pm

Re: Scoreboard thoughts

He mentioned score. That would include how many times you made a goal or capped a flag.
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Santiago ZAP

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Post Tue Jun 02, 2020 7:32 pm

Re: Scoreboard thoughts

sky_lark wrote:I think just having three columns for scores, kills, deaths, and then a fourth for ping, would be sufficient.

this sounds fantastic, with the reset each match, this would make the scoreboard much more useful and cleaner.
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Skybax

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Post Tue Jun 02, 2020 10:23 pm

Re: Scoreboard thoughts

The threat level is useful, but mostly for backend I think. As long as teams are still shuffled by threat level, we don't really need to see it. More user friendly numbers like, yeah, scores, kills, deaths, would be nicer for the end user I think
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amgine

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Post Wed Jun 03, 2020 7:07 am

Re: Scoreboard thoughts

As I said though shouldnt the boards be different based on the game type?

for example kills deaths assists are not very usefull to know in soccer

in rabbit a modified list of hold time and times you killed people while holding the rabbit flag would be more usefull

flat out KDA isfull in most game modes is fine but not all why not have it vary by gamode.
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Skybax

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Post Wed Jun 03, 2020 10:45 am

Re: Scoreboard thoughts

No amgine lol
Why would we want to take away information. Knowing kill stats is literally always useful
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amgine

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Post Wed Jun 03, 2020 3:27 pm

Re: Scoreboard thoughts

Clearly you didnt read my post because I didnt say take away info.

I jsut said put info in thats most relevant to the game mode IE NOT kda on soccer maps and not zone captures on rabbit.

I am all for score board changes but I think it should be whats relevant most to that game mode type.
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Skybax

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Post Wed Jun 03, 2020 4:03 pm

Re: Scoreboard thoughts

amgine, listen
NOT putting a statistic on the scoreboard
when the statistic is ALREADY on the scoreboard normally
is called "taking away info"
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sky_lark

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Post Thu Jun 04, 2020 12:27 am

Re: Scoreboard thoughts

amgine, I understand the point you're making, but I think it would be pretty confusing if the scoreboard details were constantly changing with each game mode. While it is true that kills/deaths aren't particularly useful for certain modes like soccer, it's always nice to see how you're performing or if anyone is tearing it up in particular. I'm not sure what else could really be shown in its place anyway that would be pretty helpful to know... ball taps? idk lol.

At the very least, just ordering the names by threat level and/or shrinking the text to not cover the threat levels with badges would be really nice.
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Santiago ZAP

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Post Thu Jun 04, 2020 9:08 am

Re: Scoreboard thoughts

Im with the sky dudes in this one, but if I may add another small detail, not so off topic here;

Right now, when deciding team balance, the game uses threat level as a base does it not? having a balanced threat level overall, the game could then also take into account how much a player scored for balance, rather than only threat level only, more specific, a players contibution to the overall team score.

Imagine for example getting 2 captures of of the 3 in you team, but having a kinda bad 0.7 KDR, the game could see you as a player that contributed 66% of the team score, and thus try to balance the game around having high-scoring players on both teams along with balanced KDRs on both sides.

This of course, implying KDR resets each round.
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amgine

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Post Thu Jun 04, 2020 4:15 pm

Re: Scoreboard thoughts

I actully agree on that point it should take into considiration how the player performed in the game and not just KDA for team balacing.

Also im not really agreeing with your point on the score board for most game modes its easy to adjust the scoreboard for values that makes sense to players even if it changes between games.

Bitmatch KDA
Rabbit Flag Hold Time And Kill Count as Rabbit
Soccer Goal Count
Nexus average flag amount average flag cap count
Capture The Flag : hold time captures recovers and cap count
Hold The Flag :flag carry time flag recoverys and flag capture count
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Skybax

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Post Thu Jun 04, 2020 7:33 pm

Re: Scoreboard thoughts

Santiago ZAP wrote:Right now, when deciding team balance, the game uses threat level as a base does it not? having a balanced threat level overall, the game could then also take into account how much a player scored for balance, rather than only threat level only, more specific, a players contibution to the overall team score.

Threat level is already based off all that. Kills, deaths, and scores, afaik
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