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| 07:58:38 | jimmythesquid | Hello |
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| 08:19:26 | tjcarter | Hi :) |
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| 08:26:58 | Nothing_Much | Hi tjcarter |
| 08:28:22 | Nothing_Much | How are you? |
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| 08:30:12 | bobdaduck | Goodmorning, gentlemen. |
| 08:30:19 | raptor | good day |
| 08:39:12 | raptor | hi tjcarter, welcome to #bitfighter! |
| 08:39:30 | kaen | morning all |
| 08:42:43 | raptor | mornin' |
| 08:49:44 | | BFLogBot Commit: c6e15dcc409a | Author: kaen | Message: conjugate selection time with serial number when building the selected object map for getSelectedObjects |
| 08:50:37 | raptor | kaen: I find your Lua API comments entertaining... :) |
| 08:50:50 | kaen | hehe |
| 08:51:07 | jimmythesquid | Hello, |
| 08:51:19 | raptor | hi |
| 08:51:21 | kaen | hi again! |
| 08:51:21 | jimmythesquid | Did you guys make any progress with the screen shots? |
| 08:51:31 | raptor | kaen: tell me about the behavior change that last commit will affect? |
| 08:52:07 | kaen | so, I changed getSelectedObjects to order the results by selection time (like two weeks ago) |
| 08:52:17 | raptor | ah ok |
| 08:52:21 | raptor | it makes sense now |
| 08:52:26 | kaen | but objects which are selected with the rubber band would clobber each other in the map -- |
| 08:52:27 | kaen | yes. |
| 08:52:38 | raptor | cool |
| 08:52:53 | kaen | I love a good excuse for bitwise magic... |
| 08:53:42 | kaen | jimmythesquid, I haven't yet. I think wat tried some windows-specific program to let him make a giant window (and thus take massive hi-res screenshots) |
| 08:53:50 | kaen | I don't know what kind of progress he made. |
| 08:54:23 | bobdaduck | BECAUSE HE'S GONE. |
| 08:54:41 | bobdaduck | WATUMO IS MISSING |
| 08:54:54 | raptor | doesn't the editor take full size shots? |
| 08:55:14 | raptor | I thought I coded everything to be 800x600, except editor |
| 08:55:16 | kaen | yes, but he requested something with a higher resolution |
| 08:55:20 | kaen | oh really? |
| 08:55:25 | kaen | let me investigate |
| 08:55:30 | raptor | yes, because the 'canvas' is a different size |
| 08:55:39 | raptor | me too... |
| 08:56:05 | kaen | whoa! |
| 08:56:07 | kaen | it's working... |
| 08:56:48 | raptor | oh yeah, look at that... big screenshots! :) |
| 08:58:06 | raptor | so is this high res enough?: http://imagebin.org/273092 |
| 08:58:59 | raptor | i suppose there won't really be a way to guarantee scale is exact across all shots... |
| 08:59:14 | raptor | oops, meeting! back soon... |
| 09:00:24 | jimmythesquid | Yeah, that seems like a fine size. |
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| 09:08:25 | raptor | another: http://imagebin.org/273096 |
| 09:08:31 | raptor | (I'm not here!) |
| 09:09:21 | raptor | what exactly was wanted again? |
| 09:21:06 | raptor | another: http://imagebin.org/273097 |
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| 09:29:00 | bobdaduck | Welcome back |
| 09:30:28 | tjcarter | raptor: hi. I wandered in because watusimoto said I should. :) |
| 09:30:45 | raptor | welcome :) |
| 09:31:31 | raptor | Actually, with respect to joysticks, I think our compile of SDL2 uses the WinMM stuff - because I don't see any DX libs linked in the resulting DLL |
| 09:31:57 | tjcarter | Do you use Mingw32 to build? |
| 09:32:12 | raptor | nope, visual studio 2010 EE |
| 09:32:16 | watusimoto | hi tjcarter |
| 09:32:37 | tjcarter | Then you almost certainly have DirectInput/XInput built in. |
| 09:32:43 | watusimoto | hi everyone who's not tjcarter |
| 09:32:49 | raptor | hi watusimoto |
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| 09:33:37 | bobdaduck | hi watumoto! |
| 09:33:41 | tjcarter | And if you don't, you should. :) |
| 09:34:03 | watusimoto | hey bobdaduck: do you have any really good looking levels in your collection you could upload to plaeides? |
| 09:34:13 | tjcarter | The MMJoystick code is just broken upstream. It was designed for the 15 pin gameport, and it doesn't even do THAT well anymore. |
| 09:34:27 | raptor | watusimoto: fullscreen screenshots from the editor preserve the bigger resolution |
| 09:34:39 | bobdaduck | I have many really good looking levels in my collection |
| 09:34:39 | watusimoto | good -- makes sense |
| 09:34:46 | watusimoto | if you have a big scree :-) |
| 09:35:03 | raptor | 1920x1600 |
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| 09:35:13 | watusimoto | bobdaduck: we need some great ones for the web design jimmythesquid is working on |
| 09:35:20 | bobdaduck | right |
| 09:35:36 | bobdaduck | So... Give me a sec to go through things |
| 09:35:39 | watusimoto | ones that would make people say "awesome -- I want to play that!" |
| 09:35:48 | tjcarter | Personally, I'm presently now having this maniacal urge to go make an iCade joystick emulator for SDL. I don't actually own an iCade, but I haven't done anything evil with a C compiler in more than a decade. Hell, it's time. :) |
| 09:36:03 | bobdaduck | Like rave party? |
| 09:36:16 | watusimoto | let's save that one for the bonus section |
| 09:36:27 | watusimoto | for when we need to go to "11" |
| 09:36:36 | bobdaduck | rofl |
| 09:37:33 | raptor | watusimoto: this is with my editor, high-enough-res?: http://imagebin.org/273096 |
| 09:37:42 | bobdaduck | level size important? |
| 09:37:52 | bobdaduck | like I personally think DnD is good looking, but its hugeee |
| 09:37:53 | watusimoto | raptor: for me yes :-) |
| 09:38:08 | watusimoto | bobdaduck: probably needs to be small enough to be graspable |
| 09:38:22 | watusimoto | a huge maze like thing is not going to look good |
| 09:38:32 | watusimoto | tjcarter: so we've been trying to capture the essence of the various controller buttons for teh controllers we know about; raptor created that symbols file I linked to in my email |
| 09:38:34 | bobdaduck | lol |
| 09:39:06 | watusimoto | we haev some c++ code for rendering the buttons; not sure if it is the look you are going for, but let me get a screenshot so you can see what I'm talking about |
| 09:39:18 | bobdaduck | OH MAN THIS IS HARD |
| 09:39:29 | bobdaduck | Can't decide on how many joke maps to mix in with the actual ones |
| 09:39:42 | watusimoto | how about none, for the moment? |
| 09:40:07 | bobdaduck | Well I mean I'm putting good ones in too |
| 09:40:19 | bobdaduck | but the jokes to seriousness ratio |
| 09:40:21 | watusimoto | actually... I can't get a screenshot of the controller buttons here because I have no controller :-( |
| 09:40:39 | tjcarter | watusimoto: Yeah, I was looking at it. I'm just not sure I'd need that for what I'm actually already committed to do. |
| 09:40:41 | watusimoto | I'll have to wait until I get home |
| 09:41:18 | tjcarter | And speaking of arcade type controllers, bitfighter really seems like it is designed for button mashing in a stand-up cabinet. :D |
| 09:41:19 | watusimoto | I just offered because it looked like you wanted to recreate the look/feel of various controllers... it might be a bit over the top for what you really need to do |
| 09:41:28 | watusimoto | indeed, it is |
| 09:41:35 | bobdaduck | Also a problem is that I make big maps so like... |
| 09:42:34 | raptor | I'm not so sure we're using DX: http://imagebin.org/273099 |
| 09:43:12 | raptor | I think we've always used the winMM code (at least since moving to SDL) |
| 09:43:56 | bobdaduck | okay watusimoto |
| 09:44:00 | bobdaduck | I've uploaded a handful |
| 09:44:16 | bobdaduck | which in this case means 7. |
| 09:44:20 | bobdaduck | I can fit 7 levels in my hand. |
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| 09:45:13 | bobdaduck | actually six |
| 09:45:22 | bobdaduck | because I didn't upload other people's levels |
| 09:45:23 | watusimoto | great, thanks! |
| 09:45:47 | | iKoda Quit (Quit: K thx bai) |
| 09:48:45 | raptor | sometimes I think bitfighter is more of an art drawing program than a game... |
| 09:49:17 | bobdaduck | making levels is an art |
| 09:49:18 | watusimoto | and with all the crazy lua stuff that kaen has been throwing in, you can automate the drawing process |
| 09:49:42 | tjcarter | Not various types. I'm really looking for a way to represent the controls of the GameController API visually so that testgamecontroller actually helps you see how yours is mapped. |
| 09:49:42 | kaen | randomly generated playable art \o/ |
| 09:49:55 | tjcarter | I would just die a lot. |
| 09:50:10 | watusimoto | ah, I see. So you really only need one set of gernalized buttons |
| 09:50:24 | tjcarter | respawning! \o/ |
| 09:50:39 | tjcarter | That's why I posted the link to the Mac 360 controller driver. |
| 09:50:51 | tjcarter | The status/test screen is just about perfect for the purpose. |
| 09:51:06 | watusimoto | ok, yeah, then what we have would not be totally useful for you |
| 09:51:28 | watusimoto | we try to match the graphics to whatever device the user has plugged in |
| 09:54:48 | tjcarter | Yeah, Steam also does that. |
| 09:55:45 | watusimoto | we need some sort of standard library that handles this sort of thing |
| 09:56:02 | raptor | the SDL2 GameController API is along those lines... |
| 09:56:04 | watusimoto | it would be useful in many games |
| 09:56:27 | watusimoto | surely it doesn't delve into what color the 4 button is on the PS controller |
| 09:56:38 | raptor | not colors, no, but button mappings |
| 09:56:57 | watusimoto | I'm talking about the physical appearance of the buttons |
| 09:57:08 | watusimoto | perhaps coupled with a font of buttons for rendering purposes |
| 09:57:13 | raptor | we have our own library! |
| 09:57:15 | tjcarter | Nah, the API basically assumes you have a 360 controller. |
| 09:57:24 | watusimoto | (there are some fonts that exist that are a good start) |
| 09:57:50 | tjcarter | 4 face buttons, 2 analog sticks, a digital DPad, two shoulder buttons, two triggers, three control buttons, and the analog sticks being clickable. |
| 09:57:55 | watusimoto | our library is limited to the controllers we have access to |
| 09:58:09 | raptor | wait wait... i saw a library about this once.. |
| 09:59:00 | tjcarter | Basically, you go into Steam and map your controller to fit the XBox button arrangement of your choice, copy the string out if necessary, and feed it to SDL as-is. |
| 10:00:10 | raptor | i think this was it, but it looks dead now: http://gamepad.sourceforge.net/ |
| 10:00:17 | tjcarter | Games then present whatever generally "standard" modern controller they want to you with controls labeled accordingly. You look at this and your controller. If your controller is vaguely typical, the mapping makes sense. If not, well, you know what the controls mean because you mapped them. :) |
| 10:02:06 | Nothing_Much | hi everyone |
| 10:02:46 | tjcarter | But unless you basically understand SDL's architecture and innards well enough to dig through its headers and source code, the API is undocumented. :( Well, I've been dealing with SDL's API since literally last century. :) |
| 10:04:05 | tjcarter | I didn't follow 1.3 development because … I kinda got out of coding all together. But I recently got a bug up someplace and decided to embark on a project, for which SDL would be useful. And I saw SDL 2.0 was out. And then I started looking at the stuff that changed. Joystick seemed the easiest place to start. |
| 10:05:08 | watusimoto | tjcarter: your explanation was helpful and clearly reflects you know what you're talking about |
| 10:05:47 | tjcarter | I've spent a fair amount of time reading the code over the past couple weeks. And I know how Sam thinks. |
| 10:06:16 | bobdaduck | Hi not_much |
| 10:06:31 | bobdaduck | Sam? |
| 10:06:34 | bobdaduck | Sam686? |
| 10:07:20 | watusimoto | different sam |
| 10:07:25 | watusimoto | different project |
| 10:07:51 | bobdaduck | Aw. |
| 10:07:55 | bobdaduck | Miss that guy. |
| 10:08:23 | tjcarter | slouken :) |
| 10:08:58 | watusimoto | raptor: that project you pointed me to takes rendering more seriously than we do |
| 10:08:59 | watusimoto | http://sourceforge.net/p/gamepad/code/HEAD/tree/trunk/data/dualshock-2.vgfx |
| 10:09:06 | watusimoto | as an example of how detailed it gets |
| 10:25:22 | jimmythesquid | I'm back |
| 10:25:33 | raptor | yeah, that's crazy |
| 10:25:37 | jimmythesquid | What do you guys think with the stars added? |
| 10:25:39 | jimmythesquid | http://georgepayne.co.uk/Images/BITFIGHTER-Mock-5.jpg |
| 10:27:35 | bobdaduck | I'm kind of overwhelmed by the screenshot |
| 10:28:19 | bobdaduck | it makes it really busy |
| 10:28:26 | bobdaduck | even ignoring the part that falls off the page |
| 10:29:28 | jimmythesquid | Yeah, I agree. |
| 10:29:38 | watusimoto | I gotta run, but I'll say I like the stars, mostly; I think they help break up what would otherwise be a vast expanse of black. We might need to make them a bit more sparse (or dimmer, as they appear under the "Soccer" overlay), however; but that's a detail. |
| 10:30:40 | watusimoto | back in a while |
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| 10:37:01 | jimmythesquid | http://georgepayne.co.uk/Images/BITFIGHTER-Mock-5a.jpg |
| 10:37:05 | jimmythesquid | Dimmer. |
| 10:37:11 | jimmythesquid | Looks better. |
| 10:39:22 | bobdaduck | the screenshot is still so big... |
| 10:39:32 | bobdaduck | Needs moar bitfighter shipz |
| 10:40:06 | bobdaduck | or at least something to spread the busy out. |
| 10:41:32 | kaen | I think I love the transparent background for the blurb |
| 10:42:52 | jimmythesquid | The screenshot being big is kinda the purpose, it both being the background and the focus. |
| 10:43:00 | kaen | also I'm fine with the screenshot hijacking your attention |
| 10:43:31 | bobdaduck | Okey then |
| 10:44:13 | kaen | because as jimmythesquid mentioned, we want newcomers to focus on that, as long as it's still easy to find the download once we've convinced them :) |
| 10:44:45 | bobdaduck | it should have airlock there... |
| 10:44:49 | bobdaduck | or maybe default levels? |
| 10:44:55 | bobdaduck | So new players recognize it? |
| 10:45:34 | jimmythesquid | Also, I don't know if you were here, but its going to change (along with the blurb) to show all the game modes. |
| 10:45:49 | bobdaduck | Yeah, and that's a good idea |
| 10:45:59 | jimmythesquid | I just used the only level I was given. |
| 10:46:10 | kaen | eh, I think we should use visually compelling levels |
| 10:46:19 | kaen | most of the stock levels... are not |
| 10:46:40 | bobdaduck | Its just that looking at it I feel like black screen GIANT SPIKEY BLUE THING |
| 10:47:53 | jimmythesquid | I wanted action shot of people playing the game but apparently screenshots of that can only be really small. |
| 10:48:55 | kaen | hmm |
| 10:49:02 | bobdaduck | Its still just like having an empty screen with something iin the corner |
| 10:49:04 | jimmythesquid | I agree, its not entirely obvious its a part of a game and not just a big spiky shape. |
| 10:49:14 | kaen | that's a good point |
| 10:49:30 | kaen | so, 800x600 isn't big enough? |
| 10:50:19 | raptor | these are 3 hi-res screenshots I made, if you missed them: http://imagebin.org/273092 http://imagebin.org/273096 http://imagebin.org/273097 |
| 10:50:36 | kaen | raptor, any idea how we could get hi-res gameplay shots? |
| 10:50:59 | raptor | i'd load teh level in the editor, go fullscreen, press <tab>, press CTRL+q |
| 10:51:20 | kaen | I mean with action taking place |
| 10:51:23 | kaen | ships, etc |
| 10:51:33 | raptor | kaen: the canvas would have to stay 800x600, but I bet if you used the boolean flag in ScreenShooter.cpp I use for the editor (while in full screen), it might work |
| 10:52:10 | jimmythesquid | I still think lots of screenshots stiched together is the best way to go. |
| 10:52:31 | raptor | but it'll just be high-res of the 800x600 - then you could probably comment out the rendering methods of the HUD |
| 10:52:46 | raptor | that's the simplest idea I have... |
| 10:53:54 | kaen | ok, I'll fiddle with that |
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| 11:00:20 | raptor | kaen: if you haven't started yet, I can probably do it quick and get you a patch |
| 11:06:54 | raptor | almsot got it... |
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| 11:10:50 | raptor | kaen: http://sam6.25u.com/upload/remove_hud-big_screenshots.diff |
| 11:11:32 | raptor | examples: http://imagebin.org/273103 http://imagebin.org/273104 |
| 11:13:13 | raptor | yes that's me exploding |
| 11:22:18 | tjcarter | yeah, life expectancy in bitfighter is … not long, is it? :) |
| 11:24:38 | raptor | more: http://imagebin.org/273106 http://imagebin.org/273107 |
| 11:24:41 | raptor | not long, no |
| 11:25:22 | bobdaduck | I DISAGREE. |
| 11:25:35 | thread_ | Its all relative |
| 11:25:35 | raptor | unless you're bobdaduck |
| 11:25:42 | bobdaduck | thread_ |
| 11:25:47 | bobdaduck | did you MAKE this candy box game? |
| 11:25:48 | raptor | in which case only a team-turret can end him |
| 11:25:54 | bobdaduck | It feels just like you |
| 11:25:56 | thread_ | no |
| 11:26:00 | bobdaduck | rofl |
| 11:26:01 | thread_ | but I'm wining it |
| 11:27:16 | bobdaduck | I'm stuck at the castle |
| 11:28:08 | thread_ | castle entrance? |
| 11:29:00 | bobdaduck | yeah |
| 11:29:07 | raptor | beserk! |
| 11:29:39 | thread_ | beserk potions, or if you can survive forever, there is an eventual end to the knights... (like 100 of them or sometihing) |
| 11:30:03 | thread_ | Also eats lots of candies to increas max HP |
| 11:30:18 | bobdaduck | I only have one berserk potions |
| 11:30:28 | bobdaduck | I DIDN'T KNOW THEY WERE IMPORTANT |
| 11:31:59 | thread_ | Well... after castle entrance and castle stairs... Then you can make more! |
| 11:32:35 | thread_ | I guess you should just eat tons of candy and level up your sword... wait, what kind of sword did you get? |
| 11:32:59 | bobdaduck | summoning xD |
| 11:33:09 | thread_ | good. Thats the good one |
| 11:33:31 | raptor | oops.. i got the health one |
| 11:34:00 | thread_ | Ive only used the summoning one. The others might be good, but I validate myself by saying summoning is the good one |
| 11:34:12 | bobdaduck | lol |
| 11:34:12 | raptor | what happens with that one? |
| 11:34:26 | thread_ | 50% chance on enemy death to summon a ally monster |
| 11:34:37 | raptor | are the monstsers good? |
| 11:34:42 | thread_ | the strength of the ally depends on the sword level |
| 11:34:47 | thread_ | lvl 1 is imp |
| 11:35:07 | raptor | what is the point of throwing candies on the ground? |
| 11:35:20 | thread_ | (;_;) |
| 11:35:27 | thread_ | onlly the emote |
| 11:35:29 | bobdaduck | :{ |
| 11:35:34 | bobdaduck | :'{ |
| 11:35:45 | thread_ | 100 is the saddest face |
| 11:35:50 | thread_ | then nothing changes |
| 11:36:41 | thread_ | at the end of the game, you can get a sword of healfiresummoning. it does all three |
| 11:37:44 | bobdaduck | I have over 200 HP and still can't beat the castle |
| 11:37:57 | raptor | you need liek 2000 |
| 11:38:03 | thread_ | you might need health potions galore |
| 11:38:07 | raptor | or 1000 with the health sword :) |
| 11:38:47 | thread_ | how is it this IRC channel is hardly about bitfighter anymore? |
| 11:38:49 | bobdaduck | lol |
| 11:38:55 | bobdaduck | Well |
| 11:39:04 | bobdaduck | When watumoto is sleeping |
| 11:39:09 | bobdaduck | development on bitfighter stops |
| 11:39:14 | bobdaduck | and we all just play candy box instead |
| 11:39:20 | bobdaduck | obviously. |
| 11:40:30 | thread_ | obviously |
| 11:42:16 | Nothing_Much | I wonder how the NUC's are for computers.. |
| 11:44:46 | thread_ | raptor: did you clear the stairs? |
| 11:44:57 | raptor | say what? |
| 11:45:06 | raptor | oh, yes - i keep dying at the dragon |
| 11:45:48 | thread_ | me too... |
| 11:46:01 | raptor | i use teleports to reheal |
| 11:46:11 | raptor | but i keep running out of potions |
| 11:47:20 | thread_ | :) because your sword only heals on a kill? |
| 11:47:26 | raptor | yep |
| 11:48:59 | raptor | is there anything but the horn to get by using the GMOOH potion? |
| 11:49:36 | thread_ | "the horn"? |
| 11:49:59 | raptor | yeah, if you use a GMOOH potion in a quest, then use it again and again until you get to the COW level |
| 11:51:03 | thread_ | I did not know this |
| 11:51:23 | raptor | not sure if the 'seed' potion gives you anything... |
| 11:52:05 | jimmythesquid | @raptor , those screenshots are almost perfect. |
| 11:52:14 | jimmythesquid | just need to not have stars. |
| 11:52:19 | raptor | jimmythesquid: ok |
| 11:52:37 | raptor | sorry I cannot get play zoomed out... |
| 11:53:04 | jimmythesquid | then I can attach them to the zoomed out maps. |
| 11:53:24 | thread_ | raptor: according the the wiki, (http://candybox.wikia.com/wiki/G.M.O.O.H._potion) the potions can get you to four special stages |
| 11:53:47 | raptor | oh really?? |
| 11:54:02 | raptor | oh yes |
| 11:54:11 | raptor | but i can't find anything in the other 3 |
| 11:57:56 | thread_ | ah |
| 11:58:11 | raptor | clone potion is really good against dragon... just beat it |
| 11:58:16 | raptor | +teleport |
| 11:58:25 | thread_ | clone+teleport? |
| 11:58:36 | raptor | + health |
| 11:58:47 | raptor | of course, oh and I've been eating lots and lots of candies |
| 11:58:57 | thread_ | whats your max hp right now? |
| 11:59:29 | raptor | I did it with about 1000 health |
| 11:59:42 | thread_ | ah |
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| 12:14:53 | raptor | I died in hell |
| 12:14:58 | raptor | sadness |
| 12:15:01 | koda | Noooo |
| 12:23:21 | thread_ | I understand that in Hell, 'I' and 'K' move you up and down |
| 12:23:55 | raptor | yes but only if your mouse is in the quest area |
| 12:24:02 | thread_ | ummm... ok |
| 12:24:11 | thread_ | plus there is a weakness to ghosts |
| 12:24:30 | raptor | oh? |
| 12:25:07 | thread_ | yea, they half you health in combat, but only yours. a summon imp will go straight through them. works on the stairs too |
| 12:25:22 | raptor | aww man, that's what keeps happening, then... |
| 12:26:04 | koda | What game. |
| 12:26:55 | raptor | this one: http://candies.aniwey.net/ |
| 12:28:05 | koda | Oh lol I left a page open yesterday an snow got 2000+ candies |
| 12:29:58 | koda | http://toys.usvsth3m.com/binary this is a tad bit challenging |
| 12:33:23 | | bobdaduck has joined |
| 12:35:54 | thread_ | bobdaduck: you missed it. We saved the world! (then got it back in jeapordy) |
| 12:35:59 | bobdaduck | NOOO |
| 12:36:06 | bobdaduck | THAT'S LIKE MY LIFE WORK |
| 12:36:25 | bobdaduck | WHAT HAPPENHED |
| 12:37:26 | thread_ | Well, it started with these little gnome clones |
| 12:37:57 | thread_ | They were taking all the pancakes and putting jam on them... JAM! |
| 12:38:06 | thread_ | trouble with a capital T |
| 12:38:07 | kaen | it ends with Alex Trebek waging the earth on a single game of jeopardy |
| 12:38:10 | kaen | gullible bastard. |
| 12:38:47 | thread_ | *snicker* kaen said gullible |
| 12:39:46 | | bobdaduck_ has joined |
| 12:41:19 | thread_ | bob has a clone! (the gnomes are still at it) |
| 12:42:26 | kaen | see, this is exactly how you get the world into pancake-gnome-related peril |
| 12:42:52 | kaen | and I am NOT going to play another game of jeopardy to save it this time. |
| 12:43:19 | | bobdaduck Quit (Ping timeout: 248 seconds) |
| 12:43:26 | bobdaduck_ | rofl |
| 12:45:38 | thread_ | What is kaen's short temper? |
| 12:46:05 | kaen | Trebek... |
| 12:46:10 | | kaen shakes fist vindictively |
| 12:46:24 | thread_ | WHOOO! (+$300) |
| 12:46:53 | bobdaduck_ | + lollipop |
| 12:54:55 | thread_ | I messed up my maths. tried to make 10 GMOOH potions... made 100 instead |
| 12:55:31 | bobdaduck_ | lol |
| 12:55:38 | bobdaduck_ | what's a gmooh? |
| 12:56:23 | thread_ | G.M.O.O.H. stands for get me out of here. its a random teleport that can go to any point on the level or to one of four other quest locations |
| 12:56:51 | bobdaduck_ | Huh. |
| 12:57:01 | bobdaduck_ | <<still can't get past the castle entrance |
| 12:57:07 | thread_ | well, I have them to spare now |
| 13:00:12 | bobdaduck_ | HOW BEAT THE ENTRANCEE |
| 13:01:46 | bobdaduck_ | nowait |
| 13:01:47 | bobdaduck_ | I did it |
| 13:01:56 | bobdaduck_ | bought 10 health potions from candy merchant |
| 13:02:13 | bobdaduck_ | and then used last berserk potion |
| 13:03:00 | | Watusimoto has joined |
| 13:03:07 | thread_ | yay! |
| 13:06:14 | Watusimoto | hey kaen -- how do you upload levels? |
| 13:06:34 | Watusimoto | you said it was from the editor, but I don't see the option |
| 13:06:38 | kaen | open it in the editor and choose upload to db from the ESC menu |
| 13:06:43 | kaen | oh |
| 13:06:45 | kaen | yeah, that's it |
| 13:06:53 | Watusimoto | 018a or 019 |
| 13:06:55 | raptor | Watusimoto: patch to make big screen shots without HUD, in-game: http://sam6.25u.com/upload/remove_hud-big_screenshots.diff |
| 13:06:56 | kaen | 019 |
| 13:07:36 | kaen | oh |
| 13:07:38 | Watusimoto | it's not there |
| 13:07:45 | kaen | the option won't show up unless you're logged in |
| 13:08:03 | kaen | because it uses your credentials to tell who owns which level |
| 13:08:18 | Watusimoto | stands to reason |
| 13:09:38 | Watusimoto | ok, there it is |
| 13:09:56 | Watusimoto | we should probably always display the option but gray it out when its unavailable |
| 13:10:00 | Watusimoto | show people what they're missing |
| 13:10:46 | Watusimoto | raptor: is that patch just something you apply, use, then unapply? |
| 13:11:04 | kaen | ah, that |
| 13:11:08 | kaen | 's a good idea |
| 13:11:21 | kaen | seriously whoever put the apostrophe next to the enter key should be shot. |
| 13:11:43 | Watusimoto | enter should be isolated on a separate keyboard |
| 13:11:51 | Watusimoto | a small auxilliary enter-only keyboard |
| 13:11:54 | kaen | or like a foot pedal |
| 13:12:00 | Watusimoto | that's it! |
| 13:12:09 | Watusimoto | like a guitar fx pedal |
| 13:12:13 | Watusimoto | stomp for enter |
| 13:12:32 | thread_ | imagine how the sound of office buildings changes... |
| 13:12:57 | Watusimoto | clickety clickety clicketk <klunk> clickety click |
| 13:13:17 | thread_ | I'd have to install a program to make a drum sound every time I hit enter |
| 13:13:18 | bobdaduck_ | rofl |
| 13:13:39 | bobdaduck_ | I LOVE YOU ALL. |
| 13:13:41 | raptor | Watusimoto: yes |
| 13:14:26 | Watusimoto | I was helping my son with his music report |
| 13:14:31 | Watusimoto | he's doing classical music |
| 13:14:45 | Watusimoto | every time I hear this piece, I think how awesome it is |
| 13:14:46 | Watusimoto | https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=gN2zcLBr_VM#t=86 |
| 13:15:53 | raptor | all i hear is static |
| 13:17:47 | | thread_ Quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) |
| 13:18:17 | | koda Quit (Quit: K Thx Bai) |
| 13:19:19 | raptor | gotta go, back later |
| 13:19:25 | | raptor Quit () |
| 13:25:01 | | koda has joined |
| 13:31:02 | Watusimoto | back to the lovely fun of tracking down the sdl crash |
| 13:34:56 | Watusimoto | interesting... it may be stick dependent |
| 13:47:55 | | jimmythesquid has joined |
| 13:48:02 | Watusimoto | hey tjcarter: |
| 13:48:09 | Watusimoto | any reason you can think of why this would fail? |
| 13:48:20 | Watusimoto | SDL_Init(0); |
| 13:48:20 | Watusimoto | SDL_InitSubSystem(SDL_INIT_JOYSTICK); |
| 13:48:20 | Watusimoto | SDL_JoystickOpen(0); |
| 13:48:34 | Watusimoto | those are the first 3 statements in my main functino, and it crashes the program |
| 13:48:59 | Watusimoto | a joystick is plugged in |
| 13:52:01 | | jimmythesquid Quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) |
| 13:53:54 | | Darrel has joined |
| 13:54:37 | | tjcarter Quit (Quit: reboot) |
| 14:11:28 | Watusimoto | well... I'm stuck again. |
| 14:11:36 | Watusimoto | I replaced our main functin with this: |
| 14:11:37 | Watusimoto | int main(int argc, char **argv) |
| 14:11:37 | Watusimoto | #endif |
| 14:11:37 | Watusimoto | { |
| 14:11:37 | Watusimoto | SDL_Init(0); |
| 14:11:37 | Watusimoto | SDL_JoystickEventState(SDL_ENABLE); |
| 14:11:38 | Watusimoto | SDL_InitSubSystem(SDL_INIT_JOYSTICK); |
| 14:11:40 | Watusimoto | SDL_Joystick *x = SDL_JoystickOpen(0); |
| 14:11:42 | Watusimoto | SDL_JoystickClose(x); |
| 14:11:45 | Watusimoto | SDL_QuitSubSystem(SDL_INIT_JOYSTICK); |
| 14:11:47 | Watusimoto | exit(0); |
| 14:11:49 | Watusimoto | } |
| 14:12:05 | Watusimoto | it works fine (i.e. no crash) when there is no stick plugged in |
| 14:12:27 | Watusimoto | I have two sticks, one marked "hama" (the blue one), and one marked saitek (the silver one0 |
| 14:12:35 | Watusimoto | when the blue stick is in, it also works fine |
| 14:12:52 | Watusimoto | but when the silver stick is in, this crashes, ether on the QuitSubSystem or on the exit |
| 14:13:10 | Watusimoto | if both are in, it also crashes |
| 14:13:27 | Watusimoto | if both are in and it crashes, and I unplug the silver stick, it stops crashing |
| 14:20:39 | kaen | did you shoot a stacktrace over to the SDL2 list? (and can you link me to the thread?) |
| 14:20:53 | kaen | needless to say, it doesn't sound like it's on our endd |
| 14:24:39 | Watusimoto | useless stack trace |
| 14:24:40 | Watusimoto | http://pastebin.com/KDRHGx4W |
| 14:25:38 | Watusimoto | The thread is email thread... not sure how to get you a usable link :-) |
| 14:26:18 | Watusimoto | there is still the possibility it is some static initializer that is causing the problem, but i doubt it |
| 14:31:02 | Watusimoto | restarting the IDE has no effect |
| 14:32:34 | Watusimoto | doing a complete rebuild... |
| 14:34:28 | Watusimoto | still crashes after full rebuild |
| 14:42:01 | Watusimoto | kaen: you added this to shutdownJoystick |
| 14:42:01 | Watusimoto | #if SDL_VERSION_ATLEAST(2,0,0) |
| 14:42:06 | Watusimoto | last night |
| 14:42:10 | Watusimoto | why? |
| 14:45:01 | kaen | couldn't build without it |
| 14:46:03 | kaen | bad fix? |
| 14:47:33 | kaen | Joystick.cpp:215:7: error: �SDL_JoystickGetAttached� was not declared in this scope |
| 14:47:33 | | koda_ has joined |
| 14:48:17 | kaen | ohh, I see |
| 14:48:29 | kaen | sorry, I thought that whole block was SDL2-specific |
| 14:49:08 | kaen | maybe just ifdef the assert? |
| 14:53:36 | | koda Quit (Quit: K Thx Bai) |
| 14:53:36 | | koda_ is now known as koda |
| 15:02:37 | | thread_ has joined |
| 15:02:43 | bobdaduck_ | Welcome backsies |
| 15:03:00 | thread_ | I, uh... I think I broke reality |
| 15:03:04 | Watusimoto | I removed the assert |
| 15:03:13 | bobdaduck_ | Oh yeah? |
| 15:03:26 | Watusimoto | I only added it in to create a snippet of code for the mailing list, and forgot to remove it |
| 15:03:40 | Watusimoto | So I'll remove your ifdefs, if that's ok |
| 15:03:47 | bobdaduck_ | I guess that's okay |
| 15:03:49 | thread_ | I just logged on before I last logged on tommorrow |
| 15:04:19 | bobdaduck_ | cool |
| 15:04:45 | Watusimoto | kaen: I also wanted to ask you about this: |
| 15:04:46 | Watusimoto | - enableCollision(); |
| 15:04:46 | Watusimoto | + if(!isCollisionEnabled()) |
| 15:04:46 | Watusimoto | + enableCollision(); |
| 15:05:09 | Watusimoto | from "fix crash when adding robots before the level starts" |
| 15:06:20 | kaen | I think that's in Robot::initialize if I remember correctly |
| 15:06:22 | thread_ | question: in 019 the levelgen object is being replaced with the bf object. In the process, "addLevelLine" is marked as obsolete... |
| 15:06:31 | thread_ | what is this going to do to mazerunner? |
| 15:06:31 | Watusimoto | yes |
| 15:06:41 | Watusimoto | what does it do (aside from the obvious) |
| 15:06:41 | bobdaduck_ | Mazerunner is going to be marked as obsolete |
| 15:06:48 | Watusimoto | it just... looks wrong |
| 15:06:48 | bobdaduck_ | in 020 we'll replace it with DnD |
| 15:07:01 | thread_ | so I cant have walls generated before the level starts? |
| 15:07:08 | bobdaduck_ | addLevelLine directly adds a level line to the level, pretty much |
| 15:07:16 | kaen | it's because when robots are added via Robot.new() the collision is enabled |
| 15:07:23 | Watusimoto | mazerunner is great sample code (or was anyway), but uses the old ways |
| 15:07:25 | bobdaduck_ | no thread_ you can already add walls with addItem(wall) |
| 15:07:36 | kaen | but if you Robot.new() in main() then (without that conditional) it gets enabled twice |
| 15:07:41 | kaen | which triggers an assert |
| 15:07:50 | Watusimoto | weird |
| 15:08:12 | kaen | but I can't just remove that enableCollision call because robots added during cycleLevel *don't* get their collision auto-enabled |
| 15:08:22 | kaen | the entire enableCollision system is crazy |
| 15:08:27 | Watusimoto | it is at that |
| 15:08:34 | thread_ | kaen: i can't tell if you are talking to me or wat |
| 15:08:34 | kaen | I tried replacing it with a straight boolean, but then everything breaks |
| 15:08:45 | kaen | I'm talking to wat |
| 15:08:59 | kaen | so apparently the codebase depends on it's stack-like behavior |
| 15:09:20 | kaen | it's also crazy that over-disabling is allowed (up to 10) but over-enabling triggers an assert |
| 15:10:09 | kaen | thread_, you can add walls perfectly fine within main() |
| 15:10:26 | thread_ | I did not know this |
| 15:10:27 | bobdaduck_ | uh yeah that's what I meant sorry thanks kaen |
| 15:10:39 | bobdaduck_ | add walls the same way you'd add any other item |
| 15:10:48 | thread_ | but only in main |
| 15:10:50 | bobdaduck_ | just outside of main it is invisible |
| 15:10:52 | Watusimoto | I want to add a comment there. How about: "Robots added via robot.new() have collision enabled. If the robot is added in the lua main() function, collision can be enabled twice, which will cause problems. This check avoids that." |
| 15:11:14 | kaen | ok |
| 15:11:16 | kaen | works for me |
| 15:11:29 | Watusimoto | I still don't totally understand it, but it seems more reasonable now |
| 15:12:10 | kaen | I'll be totally upfront |
| 15:12:16 | kaen | I don't completely understand it either |
| 15:12:28 | bobdaduck_ | I actually add walls post-start in DnD.levelgen, and then draw a line around them |
| 15:12:33 | Watusimoto | does intialize get run twice? |
| 15:12:33 | kaen | I just know that this conditional avoids hitting an assert and keeps everything working |
| 15:12:47 | kaen | hmm, I think it might |
| 15:12:47 | Watusimoto | oh |
| 15:12:54 | kaen | but only in the case that you add a robot during main() |
| 15:12:59 | Watusimoto | maybe because main() is run before the level starts |
| 15:13:02 | kaen | right |
| 15:13:04 | Watusimoto | so you add the bot, it gets intialized |
| 15:13:07 | Watusimoto | then the level starts |
| 15:13:14 | Watusimoto | and all bots get initialized |
| 15:13:27 | Watusimoto | so any added during main get initialized twice |
| 15:13:34 | kaen | but robots have to run initialize during :addItem() otherwise they won't spawn or whatnot |
| 15:13:39 | Watusimoto | right |
| 15:13:51 | Watusimoto | because if you add them during the game, they need to be intialized |
| 15:13:58 | kaen | right |
| 15:14:24 | Watusimoto | thoguh looking at the init code, I don;t really see why they wouldn't spawn without it... but whatever |
| 15:14:58 | kaen | man, there's got to be a cleaner way to do all of this |
| 15:15:32 | kaen | but I was wrestling with the collision stuff so much that I kind of stopped once I found something that worked |
| 15:15:51 | Watusimoto | yeah, that's fine |
| 15:16:15 | Watusimoto | I clarified the comment a bit so when we see it again we'll have a better understanding of how all this works |
| 15:16:43 | Watusimoto | I'm totally sympathetic to the "make it work" instinct |
| 15:16:50 | Watusimoto | "make the pain stop!" |
| 15:17:00 | kaen | heh |
| 15:17:11 | Watusimoto | that's where I am with the joysticks right now... I'd rather bug you than think about it any more |
| 15:17:16 | kaen | lol |
| 15:20:08 | | BFLogBot Commit: c5c5e7f482d9 | Author: watusimoto | Message: DRY |
| 15:20:09 | | BFLogBot Commit: b4ab95ccc84f | Author: watusimoto | Message: Merge |
| 15:20:11 | | BFLogBot Commit: af07586e427c | Author: watusimoto | Message: Remove ifdefs |
| 15:20:13 | | BFLogBot Commit: e53f70608b57 | Author: watusimoto | Message: Immortalize code posted to SDL mailing list |
| 15:20:15 | | BFLogBot Commit: e42c7e73d04d | Author: watusimoto | Message: Comments |
| 15:20:53 | kaen | bobdaduck_, thread_, checkout what I made with my polygon boolean operation plugins: http://bitfighter.org/pleiades/levels/view/90 |
| 15:21:16 | kaen | I know I'm a terrible level designer, etc |
| 15:21:19 | bobdaduck_ | its done? |
| 15:21:22 | kaen | but looks at those crazy shapes! |
| 15:21:23 | Watusimoto | wow |
| 15:21:23 | kaen | not really |
| 15:21:36 | Watusimoto | is that levelgen produced? |
| 15:21:54 | kaen | no way |
| 15:22:03 | kaen | that's a really good idea though... |
| 15:22:04 | bobdaduck_ | plugin produced |
| 15:22:14 | Watusimoto | ah, I see |
| 15:22:24 | Watusimoto | I saw the functions, wasn't sure what context they were for |
| 15:22:26 | kaen | basically I just XOR'd and substracted a bunch of circles |
| 15:22:33 | kaen | actually they're for both contexts |
| 15:22:46 | Watusimoto | right, but you obviously had a purpose in mind when you wrote them |
| 15:22:46 | kaen | I have a "cave" level I'm working that's generated with polysubtraction |
| 15:23:11 | kaen | the original use case was fitting goalzones to complex walls |
| 15:23:42 | Watusimoto | well, it opens up some real possibilities |
| 15:23:46 | kaen | yes |
| 15:23:49 | Watusimoto | as shown by your level |
| 15:23:58 | kaen | unfortunately, poly2tri is horrifically fragile |
| 15:24:24 | Watusimoto | I feel that the 3 circular areas in the upper right should be connected by narrow passages |
| 15:24:24 | kaen | so if you make a hole, and the result has to be triangulated, then there's a chance of segfault |
| 15:24:35 | kaen | ooh, good idea! |
| 15:24:40 | Watusimoto | that's just what strikes me every time I look at i |
| 15:24:41 | Watusimoto | t |
| 15:24:54 | Watusimoto | who put the enter key near the t? |
| 15:25:07 | kaen | lol |
| 15:25:21 | kaen | oh, on another note |
| 15:25:29 | kaen | I got a crash today when using the J key |
| 15:25:35 | kaen | I haven't been able to duplicate it though |
| 15:25:36 | Watusimoto | really? |
| 15:25:43 | kaen | indeed |
| 15:25:59 | Watusimoto | we should go back to triangle |
| 15:26:10 | Watusimoto | that was one solid bit of code |
| 15:26:15 | kaen | I'm afraid you might be right |
| 15:26:37 | kaen | but that prevents us from ever getting into debian |
| 15:26:49 | Watusimoto | jes |
| 15:26:52 | Watusimoto | that's an issue |
| 15:27:20 | kaen | I've spent some time looking at other mature polygon manipulation libraries that do CDT |
| 15:27:42 | kaen | unfortunately, the really good ones have external dependencies |
| 15:27:51 | kaen | e.g. the boost and GNU ones |
| 15:27:51 | Watusimoto | like a cray computer? |
| 15:27:55 | kaen | haven't seen that one |
| 15:28:04 | bobdaduck_ | Just build it yourself |
| 15:28:16 | Watusimoto | what is the external dependency of the boost lib? |
| 15:28:34 | kaen | the full boost library |
| 15:28:39 | kaen | don't we use the header-only stuff? |
| 15:28:43 | Watusimoto | I'm all about bringing in more code |
| 15:28:58 | Watusimoto | we have no real policy on that |
| 15:29:08 | Watusimoto | I like masses of statically linked code |
| 15:29:13 | kaen | ok |
| 15:29:18 | Watusimoto | raptor likes sleek dynamic linked code |
| 15:29:20 | kaen | I have not qualms about it myself |
| 15:29:23 | kaen | oh |
| 15:29:32 | kaen | I think we could... convince hmm |
| 15:29:37 | | kaen pounds fist menacingly |
| 15:29:38 | Watusimoto | he likes to build libraries, I guess :-) |
| 15:29:55 | Watusimoto | I avoid dll hell by elminating dlls |
| 15:30:07 | Watusimoto | one massive exe is my solution |
| 15:30:17 | kaen | fine by me (for windows anyway) |
| 15:30:35 | kaen | for linux, .so's are pretty straight-forward |
| 15:30:56 | Watusimoto | yes, unless they're not available for your platform |
| 15:31:09 | kaen | yeah, but we have cmake now |
| 15:31:13 | Watusimoto | true |
| 15:31:19 | kaen | it's pretty easy to detect whether or not to build the .so |
| 15:31:33 | Watusimoto | so are we in the debian repo now? |
| 15:31:39 | kaen | no |
| 15:31:50 | Watusimoto | any prospect that will change? |
| 15:32:08 | kaen | I filed an "intent to package" and have a thumbs-up from a debian maintainer |
| 15:32:17 | Watusimoto | that sounds good |
| 15:32:18 | kaen | I have to get him a .deb that's up to policy |
| 15:32:28 | Watusimoto | 019 should be |
| 15:32:39 | kaen | if it is, it will go into testing |
| 15:32:44 | kaen | and won't land in stable for like two years |
| 15:32:48 | Watusimoto | ha |
| 15:32:54 | kaen | but, we'll get a healthy stream of testers |
| 15:32:55 | Watusimoto | we'll be on 020 by then |
| 15:33:20 | kaen | people that actively use bug trackers, etc |
| 15:33:33 | Watusimoto | that will be great |
| 15:33:39 | Watusimoto | one of the items on the google list is in-game level rating |
| 15:33:57 | kaen | that's already done to my satisfaction |
| 15:34:05 | Watusimoto | I can do the ui for that pretty easily, but not sure how to communicate the level r.... what? |
| 15:34:08 | Watusimoto | how? |
| 15:34:13 | kaen | /rate up |
| 15:34:14 | kaen | /rate down |
| 15:34:17 | Watusimoto | really? |
| 15:34:19 | kaen | yep |
| 15:34:20 | Watusimoto | who knew? |
| 15:34:22 | kaen | give it a shot |
| 15:34:25 | Watusimoto | I will |
| 15:34:31 | kaen | it's in the instructions ;) |
| 15:34:37 | bobdaduck_ | new players? |
| 15:34:38 | Watusimoto | who reads those? |
| 15:34:44 | kaen | I mean the SUPER SECRET CHEAT MENU |
| 15:34:52 | kaen | that's what we settled on, right? |
| 15:34:53 | Watusimoto | I'm really tempted to do that |
| 15:35:01 | kaen | I think it would help a lot |
| 15:35:26 | bobdaduck_ | rofl |
| 15:36:11 | kaen | I think I added some aliases to rate, too |
| 15:36:26 | kaen | I think /rate 1, -1, good, bad all work |
| 15:37:22 | kaen | so bobdaduck_ |
| 15:37:23 | kaen | your new map |
| 15:37:29 | kaen | call it /rate up SO HARD |
| 15:37:52 | bobdaduck_ | lol |
| 15:39:36 | Watusimoto | I was thinking of binding that to a key |
| 15:39:45 | | BFLogBot Commit: f7a080ab4da1 | Author: watusimoto | Message: Increase insruction utility |
| 15:40:01 | Watusimoto | tortoise needs a spell checker |
| 15:40:21 | Watusimoto | I was thinking of a toggle key that toggles between +1, 0, and -1 |
| 15:40:53 | Watusimoto | can you see what you rated the level in the past? |
| 15:41:12 | | Darrel Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 15:45:13 | bobdaduck_ | If you go to a level you rated it shows which bitfighter arrow you clicked on |
| 15:45:55 | bobdaduck_ | but there's no vote history or nothin' |
| 15:46:24 | Watusimoto | I think we should show the player how they've rated a particular level |
| 15:47:23 | bobdaduck_ | We sort of do |
| 15:47:34 | bobdaduck_ | I mean given that you only have two options |
| 15:49:19 | Watusimoto | I think you should have three (+1, -1, 0) |
| 15:49:30 | kaen | I think /rate 0 works as well |
| 15:49:35 | Watusimoto | but regardless, how do you see that |
| 15:49:58 | kaen | well, I've so far entirely avoided touching the master with this stuff |
| 15:50:05 | Watusimoto | so it looks like the rating mechanism lives outside the game |
| 15:50:13 | Watusimoto | sort of an extra carricular connection |
| 15:50:34 | kaen | it really is, the rating, downloading, uploading all happens through HTTP requests |
| 15:50:49 | Watusimoto | there is a logic there |
| 15:51:05 | Watusimoto | so if I have a level that I did not get from the database, I can't rate it |
| 15:51:07 | Watusimoto | however |
| 15:51:08 | | bobdaduck_ Quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer) |
| 15:51:13 | kaen | right |
| 15:51:16 | kaen | well |
| 15:51:17 | Watusimoto | it might be good if you could |
| 15:51:25 | Watusimoto | might be |
| 15:51:45 | Watusimoto | the way that could work would be to send the md5 hash of the level along with the rating request |
| 15:51:50 | Watusimoto | but |
| 15:52:00 | Watusimoto | maybe that's just silly |
| 15:52:11 | Watusimoto | are we looking at a future where all levels are in the database? |
| 15:52:28 | kaen | all published levels, anyway |
| 15:52:46 | Watusimoto | but if I am hosting my own level, it can't be rated |
| 15:52:57 | Watusimoto | (maybe that's ok) |
| 15:53:00 | kaen | the first time an author uploads it to the DB, the level file itself contains the database ID |
| 15:53:19 | Watusimoto | is it a new line in the levelf ile? |
| 15:53:22 | kaen | yes |
| 15:53:26 | kaen | LevelDatabaseID |
| 15:53:31 | Watusimoto | makes sense |
| 15:53:40 | Watusimoto | though I could copy that into other levels |
| 15:53:48 | kaen | yep |
| 15:53:53 | Watusimoto | not that I would |
| 15:54:20 | Watusimoto | I need to think this through further |
| 15:54:35 | Watusimoto | there are some obvious limitations I hadn't considered before |
| 15:54:43 | Watusimoto | like rating levels not in the database |
| 15:54:52 | Watusimoto | I was thinking rating would be ubiquitous |
| 15:55:02 | Watusimoto | and every level would have a rating |
| 15:55:15 | Watusimoto | but that's... challenging |
| 15:55:28 | Watusimoto | just thinking aloud here |
| 15:55:44 | Watusimoto | what if you could rate any level |
| 15:55:55 | Watusimoto | and instead of sending the rating to the master, you sent it to the server |
| 15:56:23 | Watusimoto | and the server could either do something with it locally or perhaps send it off to the master via the http channel |
| 15:56:36 | kaen | the server would need your creds then |
| 15:56:52 | Watusimoto | yes that would be a problem |
| 15:57:42 | kaen | the only exploit in the current system is putting a different DBID in a level file |
| 15:57:50 | Watusimoto | that probelm could perhaps be resolved, but then you;d ahve to trust the server to at least not send a false vote |
| 15:58:00 | Watusimoto | yes |
| 15:58:05 | Watusimoto | I'm not too worried about that |
| 15:58:14 | kaen | that's why I made it tell you which map you just voted on, so an attentive player can spot someone doing something dubious |
| 15:58:25 | Watusimoto | and if we wanted to button that down, we could make the dbid a hash of the level itself or soemething |
| 15:58:32 | Watusimoto | but I'm ok with that |
| 15:58:55 | kaen | but how do you get that hash? |
| 15:58:59 | kaen | from the server? |
| 15:59:11 | Watusimoto | yeah, or maybe it's just a hash of walls. |
| 15:59:17 | Watusimoto | but let's not worry about that for the moment |
| 15:59:19 | kaen | ok |
| 15:59:22 | Watusimoto | I'm ok with the way it is |
| 15:59:56 | Watusimoto | the server knows if the map is in the database, right? |
| 16:00:05 | Watusimoto | (because it has a dbid) |
| 16:00:19 | kaen | yes |
| 16:00:22 | Watusimoto | and the client must also get that dbid from the server |
| 16:00:25 | kaen | yes |
| 16:00:40 | Watusimoto | so the client knows if it can rate or not based on local info |
| 16:00:48 | kaen | correct. |
| 16:00:49 | Watusimoto | so that's one incremental improvement |
| 16:01:03 | Watusimoto | oooh |
| 16:01:12 | Watusimoto | I want the client to know how it rated the map previously |
| 16:01:13 | Watusimoto | but |
| 16:01:18 | Watusimoto | the client could just store that locally |
| 16:01:22 | Watusimoto | perhaps |
| 16:01:25 | kaen | perhaps |
| 16:01:26 | Watusimoto | in an ini file |
| 16:01:32 | kaen | but I don't really see the benefit to this |
| 16:01:39 | Watusimoto | here's the benefit |
| 16:01:51 | kaen | since you can /rate up harmlessly if it tickles your fancy (again) |
| 16:02:08 | Watusimoto | I imagine an interface where there is an icon somewhere that shows you how you've rated the level in the past |
| 16:02:26 | Watusimoto | you can rerate the level; i.e. change your vote |
| 16:02:35 | Watusimoto | (which I assume you can already do) |
| 16:02:40 | kaen | correct |
| 16:02:58 | Watusimoto | but I thought it wuold be good to show your rating and the average rating somewhere, perhaps in the F2 info |
| 16:03:04 | kaen | ok, but ini wouldn't be authoritative, since you could vote from the website or another instance of BF for that matter |
| 16:03:07 | Watusimoto | that's why I'm interested in this |
| 16:03:27 | kaen | ok, at that point we're better of pumping it from the master or doing another HTTP request |
| 16:03:28 | Watusimoto | good point |
| 16:03:36 | Watusimoto | I was thinking about that |
| 16:03:47 | kaen | but then that's one request per player per game with a db'd level |
| 16:03:49 | Watusimoto | but level starts, and 8 people make their http requests? |
| 16:03:53 | kaen | right |
| 16:03:57 | Watusimoto | is that ok? |
| 16:03:59 | Watusimoto | or bad? |
| 16:04:05 | kaen | probably pretty bad |
| 16:04:12 | Watusimoto | that's what I was thinking too |
| 16:04:15 | kaen | would be tons better to do that through the master |
| 16:04:28 | kaen | we're talking like several orders of magnitude fewer bytes |
| 16:04:28 | Watusimoto | oh, the client already has a connection to the master |
| 16:04:43 | Watusimoto | so it could say "give me rating of level <dbid>" |
| 16:04:51 | kaen | right |
| 16:05:02 | kaen | "and my last rating, while you're at it" |
| 16:05:12 | kaen | but |
| 16:05:13 | Watusimoto | I was thinking it would have to flow from master to server to client, which was not good |
| 16:05:25 | kaen | I have caching stuff going on in the webapp |
| 16:06:03 | Watusimoto | the server could cache pretty easily |
| 16:06:06 | kaen | so reading is fine, but writing to the SQL db via master is bad |
| 16:06:17 | Watusimoto | yes |
| 16:06:19 | kaen | I mean caching generated HTML |
| 16:06:31 | Watusimoto | so sending new votes could be done via current http channel |
| 16:06:40 | Watusimoto | ah, I see |
| 16:07:04 | Watusimoto | so votes change, and pleiades needs to regen html pages |
| 16:07:17 | kaen | yes |
| 16:07:30 | Watusimoto | and if it comes via the master, it won't know |
| 16:07:35 | kaen | correct |
| 16:07:57 | Watusimoto | well, in any event my interest is in reading; writing could stay the way it is |
| 16:08:01 | kaen | ok |
| 16:08:08 | kaen | as long as that's the case, everything is fine |
| 16:08:21 | Watusimoto | because that seems to work fine, esoecially if we know that the rating will work |
| 16:08:39 | Watusimoto | in fact, we know locally that the user is logged in, and we know that the level is in the db |
| 16:08:44 | kaen | right |
| 16:08:51 | Watusimoto | we may not need to provide any feedback to the user after rating |
| 16:08:56 | Watusimoto | or at least not from the server |
| 16:09:01 | Watusimoto | we could just assume it will work |
| 16:09:04 | Watusimoto | because it will |
| 16:09:14 | Watusimoto | unless the connection fails or whatever |
| 16:09:57 | kaen | wait, are you talking about client -> server -> pleiades for rating? |
| 16:10:05 | Watusimoto | aside from a bad network, are there any conditions the user would need a response for? |
| 16:10:06 | Watusimoto | no |
| 16:10:08 | kaen | ok |
| 16:10:17 | Watusimoto | client - http -> pleiades |
| 16:10:22 | kaen | ok |
| 16:10:26 | Watusimoto | for writing |
| 16:10:33 | kaen | right now the feedback is just the level's name, author, and new rating |
| 16:10:42 | kaen | so users know there's nothing fishy going on |
| 16:10:46 | kaen | all of that comes from pleiades itself |
| 16:10:48 | Watusimoto | ok, so we could keep that |
| 16:10:50 | kaen | parsed from the HTTP response |
| 16:11:19 | Watusimoto | so what I want will only require adding a read channel to send current rating and user rating from the master to the client |
| 16:11:26 | kaen | ok |
| 16:11:30 | Watusimoto | and some new ui |
| 16:11:30 | kaen | then that sounds good |
| 16:11:33 | Watusimoto | yes |
| 16:11:46 | kaen | and also read perms for the master's SQL user |
| 16:12:07 | Watusimoto | to get the info at the master level, right? |
| 16:12:10 | kaen | right |
| 16:12:47 | Watusimoto | ok, well I'm going to sleep on it and think about it on my bike ride to work tomorrow |
| 16:12:52 | Watusimoto | and see if I still like it |
| 16:13:17 | kaen | ok |
| 16:13:31 | Watusimoto | my ultimate objective is to make rating the levels into an easy, social thing |
| 16:13:49 | kaen | sounds much better than an obscure /command |
| 16:13:59 | Watusimoto | so you want to submit your levels to the database to get feedback from users |
| 16:14:10 | Watusimoto | and capture the ratings crown and all that |
| 16:14:42 | Watusimoto | so the databse stores how each player rated the level, right? |
| 16:15:01 | Watusimoto | well, our converstaino was predicated on that being the case, so the answer must be yes |
| 16:15:07 | kaen | indeed |
| 16:15:12 | Watusimoto | ok, awesome |
| 16:15:16 | kaen | pleiades.ratings |
| 16:15:25 | Watusimoto | great |
| 16:15:27 | kaen | level_id, user_id, value |
| 16:15:32 | kaen | real simple |
| 16:15:57 | Watusimoto | ok then. time to watch the penultimate episode of breaking bad |
| 16:16:02 | kaen | so jealous |
| 16:16:03 | Watusimoto | then time for bed |
| 16:16:13 | kaen | I only have netflix, so I'm stuck on S5E08 |
| 16:16:28 | Watusimoto | yeah |
| 16:16:41 | Watusimoto | over here it's pirate bay or wait for a year |
| 16:16:50 | kaen | that's where I'm headed, I think |
| 16:16:54 | Watusimoto | netflix, amazon won't sell here |
| 16:17:03 | kaen | whoa |
| 16:17:20 | Watusimoto | amazon has a deal where you buy a dvd and you can watch it for a couple of days |
| 16:17:25 | Watusimoto | while its being shipped |
| 16:17:36 | kaen | I read somewhere that the UK got the second half of the season on netflix |
| 16:17:47 | Watusimoto | i got really pissed off when they wouldn't let me watch my own frikken dvd because I wasn't in the us |
| 16:17:53 | kaen | wow |
| 16:17:56 | Watusimoto | it's different everywhere |
| 16:18:17 | Watusimoto | anway... I'll only say that it's good |
| 16:18:32 | kaen | enjoy! |
| 16:18:35 | Watusimoto | I will! |
| 16:35:23 | | thread_ Quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) |
| 16:43:02 | | thread_ has joined |
| 16:44:06 | thread_ | quik halp! (in 018a) when I try to use WallItem.setGeom(geom) I get the error "BfObject expected, got point" |
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| 16:48:02 | raptor | uhh, dont use the dot |
| 16:48:22 | thread_ | :) I'm not used to Lua |
| 16:48:35 | thread_ | I can't believe I missed that |
| 16:49:24 | thread_ | thanks |
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| 17:43:25 | amgine123456789 | sup |
| 17:45:53 | kaen | hello! |
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| 21:00:11 | | BFLogBot Commit: adf8496efea9 | Author: kaen | Message: allow plugins to specify a description and request a keybinding to be used if none is configured (and no plugin is configured to use the requested binding) |
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