#bitfighter IRC Log

IRC Log for 2014-02-14

Timestamps are in GMT/BST.

00:54:30 kaen has joined
00:57:08 raptor ok, heading home
00:57:12 raptor later!
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05:04:47 fordcars Hi
05:05:10 raptor luajit is about 3x faster than lua-vec with my clunky implementation
05:05:18 raptor on levelgen Carnival
05:07:01 fordcars Nice!
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07:30:30 fordcars Night!
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15:45:01 raptor good day!
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16:20:52 bobdaduck Okay so this is a weird question
16:21:05 bobdaduck but can I have a way to disable self-hurting-ness on bursts?
16:21:42 raptor good morning
16:22:13 raptor that part of the code is very hard-coded
16:24:07 bobdaduck I tried making it in DnD so that bursts owners get set as well
16:24:16 bobdaduck but then it was hurting the person for whacking people
16:24:25 raptor ah yes
16:24:50 raptor not sure how to get around that at the moment..
16:24:59 raptor neutral burst hurts everyone?
16:25:10 bobdaduck yeah
16:25:35 bobdaduck Well, I could make three phaser bullets instead of a burst, add a spybug, and then detonate the spybug somehow!
16:25:49 raptor haha
16:25:59 raptor good thinking out of the box...
16:26:05 raptor spybugs have decent kickback..
16:28:59 bobdaduck not sure how to detonate it though
16:29:24 raptor Carnival stress test complete
16:30:05 raptor LuaJIT can complete on average 3x as many idle loops in the same amount of time
16:31:50 bobdaduck AMAZING
16:31:53 bobdaduck HOW DOES IT DO IT?
16:32:51 bobdaduck Am I likely to even notice a difference?
16:32:59 bobdaduck I didn't realize levelgen carnival was even laggy
16:33:18 raptor i think on large enough levels (like DnD) you will probably will
16:33:31 raptor this might let people host 150 bots instead of 50...
16:33:45 raptor because, you know...  the game is completely playable with 50 bots...
16:33:51 bobdaduck lol
16:34:10 bobdaduck Well, if fordcars ever gets around to finishing the DnD bot...
16:34:52 raptor ok great
16:35:26 raptor with 200000 iterations, lua-vec (old system) took 36 milliseconds to create a point.new()
16:35:35 raptor LuaJIT took 0 millliseconds
16:35:57 bobdaduck That's not very many milliseconds!
16:36:13 raptor oops, that time it took 1 millisecond
16:36:29 raptor so yeah, it's waaay faster with pure Lua stuff
16:36:43 watusimoto but that does not count garbage collection, does it?
16:36:48 watusimoto that's what cost us in the past
16:36:53 raptor hi watusimoto
16:36:57 raptor how would i test that?
16:37:03 watusimoto I'm not sure
16:37:03 raptor i'm doing it in a levelgen main() method
16:37:09 watusimoto you can manually trigger gc somehow
16:37:23 watusimoto we might already do it every tick, not sure
16:37:31 bobdaduck What's garbage collection?
16:38:01 raptor it what prevents you from creating too many memory leaks
16:38:59 bobdaduck WHAT
16:39:07 bobdaduck But what if I want to create memory leaks?
16:39:14 bobdaduck THIS SYSTEM IS OPPRESSIVE
16:39:24 bobdaduck AND RESTRICTIVE OF MY ABILITY TO CREATE DUNGEONS
16:41:02 watusimoto raptor: it's likely with 2M iteratonst aht GC was triggered
16:41:21 watusimoto you can also watch to see if memory use grows... if it stablizes, it must be collecting
16:41:29 watusimoto if it keeps growing it might not be
16:41:36 raptor LuaJIT has a completely rewritten garbage collector
16:41:38 raptor and
16:41:58 raptor and you can turn off the 'JIT' part to have a faster-than-normal standard interpreter
16:42:20 raptor the standard interpreter is 2-3x faster than stock Lua interpreter
16:43:26 watusimoto ok, my resistance is dropping
16:43:35 raptor also
16:43:55 raptor the hold-up now seems to be the C API binding overhead -
16:44:11 raptor I had to rewrite the methods  luaIsPoint() in LuaBase.cpp
16:44:36 watusimoto interesting
16:44:40 raptor to somehow determine if the 'point' table on the stack is a point - which has more overhead than the lua-vec lua_ispoint() method
16:45:00 raptor so i'm open to suggestions on how to improve it
16:46:19 watusimoto I'm not sure I understand the issue -- we have a value on the stack, in C++ we need to decide if it is a point?
16:47:06 raptor so you understand lua-vec added a 'type' to the Lua engine
16:47:31 watusimoto I think I know
16:47:34 raptor and was accessible in the C API with lua_ispoint() - because it was a standard type in the type enum
16:47:43 raptor types are like LUA_TSTRING, LUA_TBOOL
16:47:44 watusimoto add a type like number or string
16:47:48 watusimoto yes
16:47:48 raptor yes
16:47:52 watusimoto ok, I knew that
16:48:30 raptor so...  that doesn't exist in standard Lua and I rewrote luavec to a pure Lua implementation, this:   http://pastie.org/pastes/8733813/text
16:49:01 watusimoto ok
16:49:03 raptor having a pure Lua implementation of the 'point' type now requires me to write my own lua_ispoint()
16:49:24 raptor here it is:  http://pastie.org/pastes/8733819/text
16:49:42 watusimoto what if you had a metatable entry that specified type
16:49:47 raptor and I think using the C API bindings is slowing it down
16:50:04 raptor that's what i do
16:50:11 watusimoto ok... I'm not going to be able to look at this too closely at the moment...
16:50:15 watusimoto my train is in < 1hr
16:50:19 raptor i added a __point entry in the MT with a boolean of true
16:50:25 watusimoto so you can explain it to me when I get back :-)
16:50:45 raptor i figured that was the quickest way to tell if the Lua table was a point in c++
16:51:13 raptor but having the Lua -> c++ -> Lua overhead is slowing down the JIT part, I think
16:51:23 raptor ok
16:53:29 raptor I'm open to suggestions on how to tell if a particular Lua table is a point, within c++
16:54:08 watusimoto isn't there a metatable method for determining type?
16:54:12 raptor no
16:54:39 watusimoto well, if it existed, I'd use that
16:55:14 raptor I did patch the Lua 'type()' to return "point" within Lua
16:56:23 raptor anyways, doing 200,000 iterations of randomly moving a testitem around using :setPos() yielded ~900ms with lua-vec, but ~600 with LuaJIT
16:56:47 raptor and the :setPos() method uses the that luaIsPoint() method
16:56:51 raptor with it's args check
16:57:09 raptor but granted the overhead could also be our c++ with args checking and error checking, etc.
16:59:34 raptor it's kind of funny to think that with LuaJIT our c++ bindings are the slow part...
17:09:24 watusimoto we could tighten the argument restrictions
17:12:11 raptor oh, i need to do an s_bot stress test...
17:19:21 raptor 2000 onTick iterations took 18-25 ms with LuaJIT
17:19:53 raptor same on lua-vec took 58-65 ms
17:20:13 raptor so still about 3x faster
17:20:26 watusimoto that's a representative test
17:20:37 raptor let me do 20000
17:21:10 raptor LuaJIT:  346-251ms
17:21:21 raptor (I did 5 tests)
17:21:24 watusimoto think big.... S32_MAX
17:21:34 raptor ha
17:25:23 raptor i'm not sure i'm willing to tie up my CPU for that long..
17:27:58 raptor lua-vec:  1171 - 1479ms
17:28:12 watusimoto ok, I'm warming
17:29:07 raptor so yeah, so far it has beaten lua-vec in every vector usage with/without c api usage
17:29:50 raptor it's seems to be lightning fast when comparing pure Lua stuff  vs interacting with our API
17:31:09 watusimoto ok, I'm outta here
17:31:12 watusimoto see you in a week!
17:31:51 raptor later!
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18:19:21 bobdaduck DANGIT
18:19:22 bobdaduck I forgot
18:19:28 bobdaduck Events for lua
18:19:33 bobdaduck onShipEnteredTeleporter
18:33:29 raptor sorry...
18:34:34 bobdaduck Its okay
18:34:38 bobdaduck I don't need it very bad
18:34:54 bobdaduck It could very seriously clean up DnD.levelgen though
18:43:27 raptor I you may need an extra developer to be able to clean up DnD...
18:43:31 raptor *I think
18:44:10 bobdaduck lol
18:44:20 bobdaduck BUT WHO WOULD TAKE THAT JOB?
18:44:31 bobdaduck Maybe when Unknown gets back.
18:56:18 Teh_Bucket has joined
18:56:47 bobdaduck ITS TEH BUCKET
18:57:04 bobdaduck RUN FOR YOUR LIVES
18:57:07 bobdaduck Also hi
18:57:47 Teh_Bucket D:
18:57:48 Teh_Bucket runs
18:57:54 Teh_Bucket hi
18:58:13 Flynnn has joined
18:58:14 bobdaduck Who are you?
18:58:15 Teh_Bucket figured i'd hang out here so i could actually get in when people are playing
18:58:20 Teh_Bucket just a player
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18:59:09 bobdaduck Ah okey
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19:55:15 bobdaduck Also someone should make it so turret w=mine works
20:03:01 raptor It does work
20:03:08 raptor I think
20:03:54 LordDVG Quit (Remote host closed the connection)
20:29:35 bobdaduck The turret will point around but nothing will ever happen if I remember right
20:32:12 raptor i thought it placed neutral mines
20:32:21 raptor so you didn't see them very well
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20:44:15 bobdaduck yeah no
20:44:19 bobdaduck it just doesn't shoot anything at all
20:44:36 bobdaduck actually doesn't even track you
20:48:13 raptor huh
21:10:34 raptor back later!
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23:02:26 YoshiSmb somebody is online?
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00:54:30		kaen has joined
00:57:08	raptor	ok, heading home
00:57:12	raptor	later!
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05:04:47	fordcars	Hi
05:05:10	raptor	luajit is about 3x faster than lua-vec with my clunky implementation
05:05:18	raptor	on levelgen Carnival
05:07:01	fordcars	Nice!
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07:30:30	fordcars	Night!
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15:45:01	raptor	good day!
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16:20:52	bobdaduck	Okay so this is a weird question
16:21:05	bobdaduck	but can I have a way to disable self-hurting-ness on bursts?
16:21:42	raptor	good morning
16:22:13	raptor	that part of the code is very hard-coded
16:24:07	bobdaduck	I tried making it in DnD so that bursts owners get set as well
16:24:16	bobdaduck	but then it was hurting the person for whacking people
16:24:25	raptor	ah yes
16:24:50	raptor	not sure how to get around that at the moment..
16:24:59	raptor	neutral burst hurts everyone?
16:25:10	bobdaduck	yeah
16:25:35	bobdaduck	Well, I could make three phaser bullets instead of a burst, add a spybug, and then detonate the spybug somehow!
16:25:49	raptor	haha
16:25:59	raptor	good thinking out of the box...
16:26:05	raptor	spybugs have decent kickback..
16:28:59	bobdaduck	not sure how to detonate it though
16:29:24	raptor	Carnival stress test complete
16:30:05	raptor	LuaJIT can complete on average 3x as many idle loops in the same amount of time
16:31:50	bobdaduck	AMAZING
16:31:53	bobdaduck	HOW DOES IT DO IT?
16:32:51	bobdaduck	Am I likely to even notice a difference?
16:32:59	bobdaduck	I didn't realize levelgen carnival was even laggy
16:33:18	raptor	i think on large enough levels (like DnD) you will probably will
16:33:31	raptor	this might let people host 150 bots instead of 50...
16:33:45	raptor	because, you know... the game is completely playable with 50 bots...
16:33:51	bobdaduck	lol
16:34:10	bobdaduck	Well, if fordcars ever gets around to finishing the DnD bot...
16:34:52	raptor	ok great
16:35:26	raptor	with 200000 iterations, lua-vec (old system) took 36 milliseconds to create a point.new()
16:35:35	raptor	LuaJIT took 0 millliseconds
16:35:57	bobdaduck	That's not very many milliseconds!
16:36:13	raptor	oops, that time it took 1 millisecond
16:36:29	raptor	so yeah, it's waaay faster with pure Lua stuff
16:36:43	watusimoto	but that does not count garbage collection, does it?
16:36:48	watusimoto	that's what cost us in the past
16:36:53	raptor	hi watusimoto
16:36:57	raptor	how would i test that?
16:37:03	watusimoto	I'm not sure
16:37:03	raptor	i'm doing it in a levelgen main() method
16:37:09	watusimoto	you can manually trigger gc somehow
16:37:23	watusimoto	we might already do it every tick, not sure
16:37:31	bobdaduck	What's garbage collection?
16:38:01	raptor	it what prevents you from creating too many memory leaks
16:38:59	bobdaduck	WHAT
16:39:07	bobdaduck	But what if I want to create memory leaks?
16:39:14	bobdaduck	THIS SYSTEM IS OPPRESSIVE
16:39:24	bobdaduck	AND RESTRICTIVE OF MY ABILITY TO CREATE DUNGEONS
16:41:02	watusimoto	raptor: it's likely with 2M iteratonst aht GC was triggered
16:41:21	watusimoto	you can also watch to see if memory use grows... if it stablizes, it must be collecting
16:41:29	watusimoto	if it keeps growing it might not be
16:41:36	raptor	LuaJIT has a completely rewritten garbage collector
16:41:38	raptor	and
16:41:58	raptor	and you can turn off the 'JIT' part to have a faster-than-normal standard interpreter
16:42:20	raptor	the standard interpreter is 2-3x faster than stock Lua interpreter
16:43:26	watusimoto	ok, my resistance is dropping
16:43:35	raptor	also
16:43:55	raptor	the hold-up now seems to be the C API binding overhead -
16:44:11	raptor	I had to rewrite the methods luaIsPoint() in LuaBase.cpp
16:44:36	watusimoto	interesting
16:44:40	raptor	to somehow determine if the 'point' table on the stack is a point - which has more overhead than the lua-vec lua_ispoint() method
16:45:00	raptor	so i'm open to suggestions on how to improve it
16:46:19	watusimoto	I'm not sure I understand the issue -- we have a value on the stack, in C++ we need to decide if it is a point?
16:47:06	raptor	so you understand lua-vec added a 'type' to the Lua engine
16:47:31	watusimoto	I think I know
16:47:34	raptor	and was accessible in the C API with lua_ispoint() - because it was a standard type in the type enum
16:47:43	raptor	types are like LUA_TSTRING, LUA_TBOOL
16:47:44	watusimoto	add a type like number or string
16:47:48	watusimoto	yes
16:47:48	raptor	yes
16:47:52	watusimoto	ok, I knew that
16:48:30	raptor	so... that doesn't exist in standard Lua and I rewrote luavec to a pure Lua implementation, this: http://pastie.org/pastes/8733813/text
16:49:01	watusimoto	ok
16:49:03	raptor	having a pure Lua implementation of the 'point' type now requires me to write my own lua_ispoint()
16:49:24	raptor	here it is: http://pastie.org/pastes/8733819/text
16:49:42	watusimoto	what if you had a metatable entry that specified type
16:49:47	raptor	and I think using the C API bindings is slowing it down
16:50:04	raptor	that's what i do
16:50:11	watusimoto	ok... I'm not going to be able to look at this too closely at the moment...
16:50:15	watusimoto	my train is in < 1hr
16:50:19	raptor	i added a __point entry in the MT with a boolean of true
16:50:25	watusimoto	so you can explain it to me when I get back :-)
16:50:45	raptor	i figured that was the quickest way to tell if the Lua table was a point in c++
16:51:13	raptor	but having the Lua -> c++ -> Lua overhead is slowing down the JIT part, I think
16:51:23	raptor	ok
16:53:29	raptor	I'm open to suggestions on how to tell if a particular Lua table is a point, within c++
16:54:08	watusimoto	isn't there a metatable method for determining type?
16:54:12	raptor	no
16:54:39	watusimoto	well, if it existed, I'd use that
16:55:14	raptor	I did patch the Lua 'type()' to return "point" within Lua
16:56:23	raptor	anyways, doing 200,000 iterations of randomly moving a testitem around using :setPos() yielded ~900ms with lua-vec, but ~600 with LuaJIT
16:56:47	raptor	and the :setPos() method uses the that luaIsPoint() method
16:56:51	raptor	with it's args check
16:57:09	raptor	but granted the overhead could also be our c++ with args checking and error checking, etc.
16:59:34	raptor	it's kind of funny to think that with LuaJIT our c++ bindings are the slow part...
17:09:24	watusimoto	we could tighten the argument restrictions
17:12:11	raptor	oh, i need to do an s_bot stress test...
17:19:21	raptor	2000 onTick iterations took 18-25 ms with LuaJIT
17:19:53	raptor	same on lua-vec took 58-65 ms
17:20:13	raptor	so still about 3x faster
17:20:26	watusimoto	that's a representative test
17:20:37	raptor	let me do 20000
17:21:10	raptor	LuaJIT: 346-251ms
17:21:21	raptor	(I did 5 tests)
17:21:24	watusimoto	think big.... S32_MAX
17:21:34	raptor	ha
17:25:23	raptor	i'm not sure i'm willing to tie up my CPU for that long..
17:27:58	raptor	lua-vec: 1171 - 1479ms
17:28:12	watusimoto	ok, I'm warming
17:29:07	raptor	so yeah, so far it has beaten lua-vec in every vector usage with/without c api usage
17:29:50	raptor	it's seems to be lightning fast when comparing pure Lua stuff vs interacting with our API
17:31:09	watusimoto	ok, I'm outta here
17:31:12	watusimoto	see you in a week!
17:31:51	raptor	later!
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18:19:21	bobdaduck	DANGIT
18:19:22	bobdaduck	I forgot
18:19:28	bobdaduck	Events for lua
18:19:33	bobdaduck	onShipEnteredTeleporter
18:33:29	raptor	sorry...
18:34:34	bobdaduck	Its okay
18:34:38	bobdaduck	I don't need it very bad
18:34:54	bobdaduck	It could very seriously clean up DnD.levelgen though
18:43:27	raptor	I you may need an extra developer to be able to clean up DnD...
18:43:31	raptor	*I think
18:44:10	bobdaduck	lol
18:44:20	bobdaduck	BUT WHO WOULD TAKE THAT JOB?
18:44:31	bobdaduck	Maybe when Unknown gets back.
18:56:18		Teh_Bucket has joined
18:56:47	bobdaduck	ITS TEH BUCKET
18:57:04	bobdaduck	RUN FOR YOUR LIVES
18:57:07	bobdaduck	Also hi
18:57:47	Teh_Bucket	D:
18:57:48		Teh_Bucket runs
18:57:54	Teh_Bucket	hi
18:58:13		Flynnn has joined
18:58:14	bobdaduck	Who are you?
18:58:15	Teh_Bucket	figured i'd hang out here so i could actually get in when people are playing
18:58:20	Teh_Bucket	just a player
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18:59:09	bobdaduck	Ah okey
19:02:02		Flynnn has joined
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19:32:34		Flynnn has joined
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19:55:15	bobdaduck	Also someone should make it so turret w=mine works
20:03:01	raptor	It does work
20:03:08	raptor	I think
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20:29:35	bobdaduck	The turret will point around but nothing will ever happen if I remember right
20:32:12	raptor	i thought it placed neutral mines
20:32:21	raptor	so you didn't see them very well
20:39:29		YoshiSmb has joined
20:44:15	bobdaduck	yeah no
20:44:19	bobdaduck	it just doesn't shoot anything at all
20:44:36	bobdaduck	actually doesn't even track you
20:48:13	raptor	huh
21:10:34	raptor	back later!
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23:02:26	YoshiSmb	somebody is online?
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